Hyperloop One Is a Dumpster Fire
Not only is the Hyperloop a fantasy idea with severe technical and political impediments to ever getting built – the main company working on the project is facing major lawsuits alleging the company is rife with “nepotism, waste, and assault”:
How the relationship between the leading investor and the founding chief executive of Hyperloop Technologies Inc. deteriorated is laid out in a wrongful termination lawsuit filed Tuesday in Los Angeles County Superior Court. BamBrogan and three other former high-ranking officials at the start-up say they were axed or forced to resign for speaking out to higher-ups and shareholders about widespread mismanagement and poor behavior at the Los Angeles firm.
The allegations primarily target Pishevar and fellow investor Joe Lonsdale, who were said to have forced the company into multiple business deals that benefited friends, family members or themselves. Pishevar also regularly turned the Arts District headquarters of Hyperloop One, as the company now refers to itself, into a venue for showboating and personal parties, the lawsuit claims.
I thought this part was especially notable:
The group had tried to convince Lloyd – a former Cisco Systems executive named CEO last September as BamBrogan moved down to chief technology officer – that engineering had become a sideshow to marketing exercises.
I would go further in that last line and replace “had become” with “always was.” The hyperloop is mere hype, a marketing exercise to which engineering is a sideshow. It’s a vomit comet that has already raised suspicions about what’s going on here:
“I sense a bit of hucksterism right now that’s helping companies raise money,” says Ralph Hollis, a research professor of robotics at Carnegie Mellon University who is an expert on maglev tech.
Yep. I sense it too. And this lawsuit would seem to confirm that diagnosis.
If the hyperloop was feasible, it would be cool. But it’s not feasible. So let’s stop wasting everyone’s time and money with this and get back to doing the work to get high speed rail up and running as soon as possible.
I think the real reason Elon Musk started HyperLoop was so he could stop CAHSR construction by promising a nonexistent alternative, thus preserving his Tesla profits here in California.
Adam Tauno Williams Reply:
July 14th, 2016 at 9:27 am
The “real reason” is not so sophisticated – he’s nuts. This happens to extremely wealthy and powerful people surrounded by “YES” men – from Edison on down the line. Some great initial accomplishments followed by a whole lot of squandered opportunity. Musk is not going to support HSR, or rail in general, because it isn’t about him; Tesla and the Hyperloop are – so he won’t let them go even when they have clearly failed [his Tesla company is not without similar problems].
Danny Reply:
July 14th, 2016 at 11:03 am
ah, but that doesn’t fully explain why he hasn’t put a penny into the companies that keep the idea afloat, even when they’re sputtering
Musk is canny: what he runs on isn’t just the anarcho-capitalist South Bay ideology of a tech exec who’s never been told no and who has to deny that half his money comes from Sacramento and Washington, but a deep-seated trope in American society of the Brave Little Tailor who slew the giant through individual ingenuity–the media lap him up even as he says that he defied gub’mint, megacorps, and the media itself; it’s why fantasies about Galileo and Columbus have such a continued pull on this side of the pond despite being crude 19th-century fabrications
“Wired” readers love the fantasy of a “disruptive technology,” not least because each vaunted technology has always failed in reality to bring about the utopia they long for (THIS time it’ll be different!): Musk’s successes are always conservative–direct marketing of electric cars and capacitors, tweaking the manufacturing process for rockets
you can see this nonsense with self-driving cars (news reports of how they keep plowing into obstacles? reports of it are just the media afraid of a technology that’ll end Big Oil and Big Car!)
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 5:21 pm
But Musk is a genius!
John Nachtigall Reply:
July 14th, 2016 at 12:57 pm
There are no Tesla profits do there is nothing to protect
StevieB Reply:
July 14th, 2016 at 4:30 pm
What is your evidence Elon Musk has made no profit from Tesla?
John Nachtigall Reply:
July 14th, 2016 at 10:08 pm
Tesla is a public company it has audited financial results. Those results show it has not made a profit.
So that is my evidence
Want more
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-teslamotors-cash-insight-idUSKCN0QE0DC20150810
Honestly, this is simple. Do,you just demand evidence reflexively or do you just not follow the news?
Roland Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 2:40 am
http://insideevs.com/tesla-q2-results-reports-adjusted-profit-26-million/
John Nachtigall Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 9:55 am
fail
“The non-adjusted result (ex-one time items and the such)was a second-quarter net loss of $30.5 million.”
http://money.cnn.com/2016/05/04/news/companies/tesla-earnings/
The company posted a net loss of $282 million for last quarter.
http://www.cnbc.com/2016/05/03/tesla-stock-is-not-a-buy-no-matter-what-earnings-say-commentary.html
Furthermore, Tesla’s market cap is nearly two-thirds of General Motors’ market cap. This is despite the fact that General Motors has a history of selling 10 million cars at a profit each year and Tesla sold less than 100,000 cars last year at a loss. They would have to sell 6.6 million cars this year to justify its current valuation. With less than 400,000 cars on pre-order that doesn’t appear likely anytime soon.
http://www.wsj.com/articles/tesla-china-sales-declined-significantly-ceo-says-1421186754
It was 2016, now it is 2020. its the Pets.com and Webvan of the automotive world. At some point someone will shout the emperor has no clothes and this will all come crashing down. Musk is the PT Barnum of his day, he is not a con man, the companies (or in PT’s case the exhibits) are real but not what they are implied to be.
Roland Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 1:13 pm
Has it ever crossed your mind that Elon might be heading towards a SpaceX IPO and, if so, how much do you think he might gross out of it?
Joe Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 2:43 pm
Does Amazon operate with a massive profit?
All that glitters is not gold.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 5:20 pm
I don’t know about Amazon USA but Amazon in Germany is notorious for paying ridiculously low wages for most of its workers…
StevieB Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 9:51 am
Do you not understand the difference in Tesla reported profits and Elon Musk profit from stock options resulting in Musk’s stake in Tesla currently at 31,100,644 shares worth just over $7 billion? The original post was on Elon Musk’s profit and not Tesla. Do you not follow the news of Musk’s most recent exercise of 5,503,972 stock options?
John Nachtigall Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 9:59 am
oh you mean his conversion of investor captital to his pockets. Then I agree, Tesla has been a fine “profit” source for Musk. Normally I would have thought those would be called investment gains, the profit nomenclature threw me off. I am on the same page now.
We agree, Musk will do anything to keep the Tesla ball in the air as long as possible.
I think you underestimate him, however. I dont think it is a distraction. I think it is a try at making another company he can get to a high valuation so he can cash in. Its like Tesla 2.0, or 3.0 if you consider Solar City Tesla 2.0.
Regardless, we agree.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 5:30 pm
People seem to mistake Musk for the second coming of Stephenson father and son rolled into one. Instead he is more a second coming of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Hudson
Jerry Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 1:25 pm
And I hope you both agree that his tax rate will be much different than the average working person.
Which merits of course a great big yawn, or a great big, “So What.”
StevieB Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 3:31 pm
Elon Musk is about to do something weird for a billionaire, pay ~$600 million in taxes.
But the problem is, if the venture capitalists really understood the technology, they would not be investing in it at all.
Again I’d like to reiterate my position: for as much of a joke the Hyperloop is, there’s real money in similar (AVAC) systems designed for trash. Given SF’s street feces situation, Musk could probably pay to install it down Market Street and branch the system into individual buildings from there. Trash would be piped down to Pier 80 and directly onto barges or railcars. He could then build himself a private island.
Alas, ‘Twas not to be.
car(e)-free LA Reply:
July 14th, 2016 at 10:42 am
Those trash systems are terrific, but expensive to install in existing developments. However, New Songdo City in Incheon, South Korea was built from the ground up with a system like that if you are looking for an existing example.
Neil Shea Reply:
July 14th, 2016 at 11:11 am
Sounds like the fancy baggage handling systems at Denver and Munich airport that turned people’s luggage into trash
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 5:36 pm
I have not yet had the “pleasure” to fly out of “Munich” airport. What’s the deal with their baggage system?
webster Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 8:26 am
Or for a local example: Hudson Yards is supposedly employing this. Though, to be fair, trash compactors
might be good enough in most cases?
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/04/nyregion/garbage-collection-without-the-noise-or-the-smell.html?_r=0
Meanwhile in Ohio: http://www.uc.edu/news/NR.aspx?id=23570
Ted K. Reply:
July 14th, 2016 at 1:58 pm
uc.edu = Univ. of Cincinnati
Title – Hyperloop UC Students Zoom Ahead in Global Competition
Dated – 12 July 2016
Paul Dyson Reply:
July 14th, 2016 at 7:01 pm
That’s hilarious. Nothing built yet, don’t know if it even will work, but design an app to sell tickets, as if there are no systems out there to sell tickets! USA leads the world, in vaporware.
Roland Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 3:20 am
As far as “nothing built yet”, here is the Delft braking/suspension subsystem 3D animation followed by the real “look Ma, no wheels!” thing on the move: https://youtu.be/XQYDtgJu9JY?t=912
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 5:43 pm
Country blocked.
Roland Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 12:24 am
Try this: http://hola.org/
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 5:45 pm
What’s that?
Edward Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 5:55 pm
I’m not familiar with Hola, but a VPN is a virtual private network. Essentially, your requests go over the Internet encrypted to another site where they go on the Internet. Your requests appear to be coming from another location. This gets around censoring and country blocking.
Many companies use VPNs so that workers can work from home as if they were on the company internal network. Everything on the Internet is encrypted in both directions.
All of this is in theory. YMMV
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 5:44 pm
We’re gonna build the best vaporware and make the laws of physics pay for it. Bigly.
Roland Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 2:47 am
Here is the MIT version: http://fortune.com/2016/05/15/mit-hyperloop-pod-design-reveal/
Meanwhile in Holland: http://www.web.delfthyperloop.nl/#!livestream/jngqk
Roland Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 1:28 pm
In this clip, the Delft loop CTO explains why they gave up on the original compressor/air cushion idea: https://youtu.be/XQYDtgJu9JY?t=2002.
The next question is about the construction of the actual test track. Has anyone see trucks carrying dirt on Rocket Road and, if so, can you ask the drivers if they are digging a tunnel?
agb5 Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 3:47 am
I can see where this is going, first they give up on the “air cusion” concept as not viable and switch to magnetic levatation, next they will give up on the “vacuum tube” concept as not viable at which point they will have re-invented a classic maglev train which was already declared not viable 10 years ago.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 5:46 pm
Maybe they can buy some old patents from Thyssen Krupp at discount rates…
Off Track:
The FRA is considering mandating minimum crew size on trains.
http://railvoices.org/freight-railroads-are-braking-for-regulatory-creep/
http://www.wsj.com/articles/regulators-industry-debate-how-many-it-takes-to-run-a-train-1468515766
Aarond Reply:
July 14th, 2016 at 11:33 am
Obviously they’re modeling it off our own SB 730. Though I doubt Congress would allow this to happen, given that nobody (the railroads, oil lobby, coal lobby, etc) wants it. I reckon this is a way to bait them into committing to PTC instead.
adirondacker12800 Reply:
July 14th, 2016 at 12:16 pm
Those pesky railroad employees bring along their kidneys and bladders when they come to work….
JimInPollockPines Reply:
July 14th, 2016 at 10:16 pm
yeh plus they expect food and water. Maybe if they weren’t allowed to eat or drink they wouldn’t need to worry about kidneys and bladders.
Jerry Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 1:29 pm
It all, ‘Depends’.
Jerry Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 1:29 pm
on how you look at it.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 5:46 pm
Doesn’t it always?
Jos Callinet Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:41 am
” …. on how you look at it.” Brings to mind, DESIGNER ‘Depends’ for ladies and gentlemen! If we’re gonna have to use ’em, let’s at least make wearing them into a fashion statement.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 5:47 pm
Everything can become a fashion statement. Even long beards and fugly glasses…
Car(e)-Free LA Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:21 pm
Unfortunately
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 3:59 pm
aye
http://usa.streetsblog.org/2016/07/13/when-will-the-feds-stop-outlawing-railcars-used-by-the-rest-of-the-world/
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 5:47 pm
Probably the same time sports teams stop moving around like traveling circuses (which they literally only do/die in North America and Communist East and Central Europe)
Whee, here comes SMCo. Hwy 101 widening … thanks in part due to Caltrain’s failure to keep up:
MTC shifts $8.9m toward planning, engineering and environmental studies for SMCo. Hwy 101 HOV express lanes
Bay Area Council wants the lanes opened in under 5 years … to speed the project, Caltrans is said to have agreed to begin engineering & design in parallel with environmental studies.
synonymouse Reply:
July 14th, 2016 at 9:20 pm
Shades of Babs Boxer in Marin
Roland Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 3:57 am
What is NOT reported in the press is that MTC simultaneously allocated another $387M to the Caltrain “electrification” project: http://mtc.legistar.com/gateway.aspx?M=F&ID=e5973599-e7fe-4a2d-92e3-435282313c5a.pdf.
Q: What is this project REALLY all about?
A: https://youtu.be/_a-3nMwjtPI (surprise?)
Trump’s stance on high-speed rail clashes with House Republicans’
synonymouse Reply:
July 14th, 2016 at 9:22 pm
The Donald could a lot of supporters. His choice of VP is also not very strategic.
synonymouse Reply:
July 14th, 2016 at 9:23 pm
could lose
Tokkyu40 Reply:
July 14th, 2016 at 9:40 pm
He’s not running for the republican nomination anymore. He’s running for the general election.
Most of the hard-core party members will vote for him no matter what he does because he’s the nominee and they fear Hillary.
The handful of crazed Tea Party ideologues that will bail out on anyone who isn’t 300% pure are far outweighed by the moderates he needs to win. After 8 years if unrelenting campaigning by opponents, more than half of Californians still want HSR. It’s a marketable product in elections.
JimInPollockPines Reply:
July 14th, 2016 at 10:26 pm
The problem
( one problem anyway) with trump is that we don’t know if he will stand on his own if elected or if he will become a pawn of the party. Obviously the republican party is not going to allow him to put up trade barriers or build a wall, or build things they are against like hsr. They are either going to handle him their way, or they will block what he tries to do if they don’t like it.
Joe Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 7:11 am
I don’t believe it. It’s a trap.
StevieB Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 10:03 am
“He has no consistency about him. He says whatever comes into his head at the moment. ” – Ruth Bader Ginsberg
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 5:52 pm
RBG is right.
I would not take any public statement of Trump indicative of any policy he will actually implement.
However, prudence dictates to take his racist statements at face value. Taking racists to be joking never ends well.
Eric M Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 9:46 am
So basically cherry picking
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 5:48 pm
No. A cautionary principle.
It matters little what his actual opinions on high speed rail are (unless of course he gets into power)
But not taking racist statements seriously never ends well.
Ted Judah Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 10:22 am
Trump is, at heart, a real estate developer…and that is…unfortunately perhaps…the Executive mindset the country needs. He understands the dynamic between demographics, wealth creation, supply chain management, public relations. He realizes, like Ahhnold, the potential of high speed rail as a tool to re-open America’s frontier, if you will.
Yes, he has to pander to social conservatives and libertarian voters who suffer from an utter delusional view of the world. BUT, as a candidate with “New York values”, he’s much more pragmatic. When he talks about Obamacare being replaced with something where people “don’t die in the street”, it’s because, unlike Cruz, he’s seen it himself walking through Manhattan.
I honestly feel, as a die-hard Bernie supporter in the primaries, that Trump will get more done that Clinton, especially on economic issues. The GOP in Congress will absolutely hate it and despise him for ruining their brand and walled garden. But they will grit their teeth every time and relent because they know most people do not care about the “Game of Votes” in DC, but about getting more money in their pocket.
adirondacker12800 Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 11:26 am
Even conservatives say his tax plan is a disaster with little connection to reality.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 5:48 pm
Wait, Trump has a tax plan?
Car(e)-Free LA Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:23 pm
Trump’s tax plan, trade policies, misplaced spending (walls and militaries) and protectionism are guaranteed to harm America’s economy.
Car(e)-Free LA Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 2:44 pm
Also, I pick candidates based on having well thought out plans–one of the reasons I picked Hillary over Bernie. Trump has no plan on how to execute his ideas, nor do I think he has the desire or focus to create them.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:00 pm
Bernie does not have a plan?
Aarond Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 2:51 pm
If Trump actually wins, the GOP has no option other than to work with him since Trump is a centrist that will work with the Democrats to get what he wants.
Republican districts are in a deep depression due Saudi price dumping, while China is no longer respecting Intl law. There’s plenty of support for trade protectionism. And there’s enough GOP moderates and Democrats that will fund HSR.
The GOP will endorse anything that wins elections. If Trump wins, then that’s what the new zeitgeist is.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 5:53 pm
If Trump is – arguably – good at one thing, it is making deals. I am sure a large part of his statements are “negotiation trash”; positions he does not actually believe in to dump in negotiations to “protect” the positions he actually believes in. Unfortunately democrats seem unable of this basic negotiation tactic…
Tokkyu40 Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 8:27 pm
What Trump is good at is selling stock in his projects, which he hires his companies to develop and manage as subcontractors while borrowing heavily to cover the initial costs.
When the projects go bankrupt he stands at the front of the line to get his contracts covered, walking away with the bulk of the money while the investors get the losses.
And he can bring his expertise to the nation as a whole.
Reality Check Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:04 pm
Devastating story: Donald Trump’s Deals Rely on Being Creative With the Truth
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:01 pm
Trump is not hurt by negative press.
Which does not mean we shouldn’t expose all his bad actions…
Car(e)-Free LA Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 12:48 pm
Hillary wants HsR too though, so it isn’t an issue, because they both agree.
Eric M Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 12:56 pm
She says she wants “higher” speed rail and specifically left out CA HSR
Roland Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 1:32 pm
What does that say about Hillary?
Car(e)-Free LA Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 3:00 pm
That she, like Trump, has not yet fully created a national HSR plan, which is fairly understandible. One could safely assume she would just try to advance Obama’s vision.
Aarond Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 3:10 pm
The original “American high speed rail” comes courtesy of LBJ and the Metroliners which became the Acela:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Speed_Ground_Transportation_Act_of_1965
“So I hope this meeting this morning will provide a platform for us to get that kind of transportation. We must do it. We must start getting it now. In the past 15 years, travel between our cities has more than doubled. By 1985–only 20 years away–we will have 75 million more Americans in this country. And those 75 million will be doing a great deal more traveling.”
adirondacker12800 Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 3:42 pm
Every time the Democrats try to do something about it the Republicans refuse to fund it. Or pull the funding if it’s got it.
http://www.wnyc.org/story/99492-governor-christie-formally-kills-arc-memo/
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 5:59 pm
Her husband also tried HSR in 1992.
Realistically a Democrat administration has – at most – two years to get major policy proposals through. After they lose their first midterm this window has closed and is unlikely to reopen even in a two term presidency. Clinton and Obama both spent most of those two years on healthcare. For both HSR was an afterthought and consequently very little was achieved. Clinton did manage to get the Acela done and Obama may well have saved CAHSR. Let’s see what Hillary spends her two years on. If she gets them. Given the way districts are gerrymandered she might not actually have a House majority…
Aarond Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 7:22 pm
What saved CAHSR, or at least greatly expedited it, was all the other states giving back the grants they had gotten for HSR. The money that would have otherwise gone to Florida, Ohio and Wisconsin flowed into California and the NEC.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 7:34 pm
Yes but without Obama that money would never have been spent on any HSR anywhere.
Jos Callinet Reply:
July 25th, 2016 at 10:38 am
@ Car(e)-Free LA: I think Hillary Clinton cares very little one way or the other about rail, high-speed or otherwise. Rail is in the sub-basement of her priorities – a non-issue to her. Her agenda is going to be so taken up with other far more pressing priorities that she’ll never get around to actively pushing for rail transportation. It’s an issue which will remain completely below the range and reach of her radar.
Eric Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 1:23 am
Don’t get too excited, in a few days he’ll say the opposite (if he hasn’t already). He doesn’t have any actual policy positions, he just says whatever he thinks will win over the crowd he’s currently speaking to.
Eric M Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 12:58 pm
I guess he could just lie under oath like Hillary then
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 6:02 pm
Benghazi! Nine eleven! That guy Republicans think Clinton murdered! Conspiracy!
What’s next?
Learned elders of Zion?
Eric M Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 9:49 am
Just keep living with your head in the sand about Hillary and keep telling yourself she is honest and trustworthy over and over again.
Zorro Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 12:04 pm
Yes, and some will keep saying Heil tRump, Fuhrer…
No I’m not voting for tRump…
Zorro Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 12:06 pm
And I will never vote for any living member of the GOP/Republican Party(same damn thing really)…
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 5:50 pm
Let’s dig up Lincoln and Grant. I’d vote for a ticket headed by either of them in a heartbeat.
As for the whole thing about Clinton… I never said she was “honest and trustworthy” but the Email thing is such a minor and distraction issue. I much more care about whether or not Trump actually committed fraud then about those damn emails.
Eric Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 9:10 am
100 year old corpses FTW
Car(e)-Free LA Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:27 pm
I don’t vote based on party alone, but I won’t vote for anyone who opposes universal healthcare, more infrastructure, a fair tax code, increased immigration, climate change reform, free trade, and general internationalism.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:03 pm
So basically no Republican after Eisenhower or maybe Nixon….
Danny Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 11:55 am
as a foreign-policy researcher I can certify that Clinton’s a towering grease fire in that field: her flops come from surrounding herself with people who’ve proven personal loyalty to her, generating “stovepipes” that allow only one course of action (Honduras, funding Syria’s “rebels”–Pence has even THANKED her for tipping the White House’s balance on Libya 2011)
what she did since 1994 was to redefine “liberal” as “defending the Clintons personally”–you’d have prominent feminists defending the most powerful man on earth seducing someone barely old enough to drink; it’s typical codependent stuff–any bad news HAS to have its source in “ratf—ing” by the other party
so when Comey lists all the reasons her secret server was a very, very bad thing–and then says he won’t do anything because of political pressure, people aren’t gonna react POSITIVELY
Zorro Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 12:00 pm
Not all the emails on a server are for the same person, that is almost impossible…
Joe Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 12:40 pm
Right and even More ridiculous:
This is about 3 emails out of 30,000. Those three had only a (C) in the text to indicate it has classified content.
General Patreus knowingly shared many classified documents with a journalist which whom he had an affair and then lied to the FBI about it.
They cannot show Clinton had an intent to leak or mishandle material and thus commit a crime, therefore it’s not illegal. Having three emails out of 30K isn’t a crime. Indent matters.
Eric M Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:49 am
So what you just said is incompetence is okay. Truly sad.
1 classified email/document or 1 million classified emails/documents, it does not matter. Breaking the law is breaking the law. But, but, but officer, I was only going over the speed limit by 1 mile an hour.
No intent???
Apparently you forgot Clinton instructing her staff member Jake Sullivan to transmit classified data without markings “If they can’t, turn into nonpaper w no identifying heading and send nonsecure.”
What is even more laughable is someone like you blindly following of a person like Clinton because of a specific a specific party, regardless of ones policies or incompetence.
And in case you or anyone missed it, here is FBI director Comey talking about Clinton
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 5:51 pm
What about Trump “University”, though?
Joe Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:27 pm
1) Incompetence isn’t a crime. The law requires intent. Sorry.
2) mishandling 3 emails out of 30,000, those which are denoted by only a (C) in the body and not “Classified” isn’t incompetence. Sorry again.
Hate her all you want but don’t make up stuff.
Car(e)-Free LA Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:28 pm
She is not being prosecuted. Comey cleared her. End of story.
Joe Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:28 pm
Hey,
Post the Comey quote where he recommends she be charged with a crime.
John Nachtigall Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:33 pm
She lied. And has lied about it since
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/how-the-fbi-director-systematically-dismantled-hillary-clintons-email-defense/2016/07/05/55c444ba-42da-11e6-8856-f26de2537a9d_story.html
She is also not being charged with a crime.
Both those things are facts
Joe Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:47 pm
No charges because no crime.
Over the hours of congress testimony and no purging, no living.
You are entitled to hate her without just reason but don’t make up crimes without explaining why there wasn’t an indictment and disparage me for not drinking your kook-aid.
Joe Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:52 pm
Over ten straight hours of hostile congressional questioning and still no perjury.
No crime, time after time.
Meanwhile the conservatives are about to nominate Donald Trump. What moral standards you have.
Jerry Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:55 pm
Blair and Bush both lied with much greater consequences. But of course they are not running.
Joe Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:55 pm
Comey didn’t say she lied.
Three emails out of 30,000 where marked with a “C” in the text. The
Others were not makered.
It’s in the video.
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=493672744162717&id=323554884507838&refsrc=http%3A%2F%2Flieu.house.gov%2Fmedia-center%2Fpress-releases%2Ficymi-congressman-lieu-questions-fbi-director-comey-during-house&_rdr
Jerry Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:58 pm
Most classified information is a joke. Some of the people who classify it just don’t want it available under the Freedom of Information Act.
Joe Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 10:08 pm
Yes and there is a double standard.
https://lieu.house.gov/sites/lieu.house.gov/files/Lieu%20Statement%20OGR.pdf
Jerry Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 10:22 pm
Pfc. Manning leaked information that revealed that U.S. officials said in private more or less what they said publicly. But a little less delicately worded. Former Defense Sec. Gates said it’s no big deal.
“Governments deal with the U.S. because it’s in their interest — not because they believe we can keep secrets.”
adirondacker12800 Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 10:59 pm
Republicans in high dudgeon over over the current email scandal didn’t have anything at all to say when the Bush Adminstration lost millions of emails.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bush_White_House_email_controversy
Jerry Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 11:09 pm
Or ‘Lost’ $20 Billion Dollars in newly printed money in Iraq.
But that’s Obama’s fault because he pulled the troops out before they could find it.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:04 pm
Secrecy is the death of democracy…
Tokkyu40 Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 8:31 pm
“Not all the emails on a server are for the same person, that is almost impossible”
It’ s her server. She’s the only client.
Zorro Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 8:35 pm
Just cause it was Her server, doesn’t mean everything was for Her, a server is not just for one address, and emails can be forwarded too.
Joe Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 10:12 pm
Congress has private email servers and classified material.
Also
John Nachtigall Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 4:19 am
I am really glad the congressman can do math
Joe Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 6:59 am
Me too. Sadly the article you cited didn’t.
Jerry Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 12:23 pm
A really different 3rd party outlook would help in a lot of these problems.
Especially since the 2 major parties are complicit in most of problems.
Joe Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 12:30 pm
Then ***do*** something. Organize around something besides complaining the other two suck and make that 3rd party. Or Join one and try to change it.
malcontents with the two parties were behind the awful top two primary initiative. It was supposed to prevent extremist candidates and give us moderates. Now the CA November election ballot is limited to two candidates.
Jerry Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 12:51 pm
I have ***done*** something. Including donating money to this very blog.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 5:52 pm
If there were a possibility to buy CAHSR or Texas Central shares that might also be something to look into…
Car(e)-Free LA Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:28 pm
I would buy them.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:06 pm
I probably also would, but at the levels of investment I could afford it would probably cost me more to own them than to buy them…
Where has the “just go and buy a physical share at face value” gone? Why do I have to pay for an account that becomes cheaper if I buy and sell at insane rates?
Zorro Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 1:00 pm
If the US had a Multiparty Political system, like oh, Proportional Representation in Congress, like is in Europe, until that time there won’t be any chance for a 3rd Party to emerge…
And no the US is not setup for more than 2 party rule at present, I think that would require a Constitutional Amendment…
Car(e)-Free LA Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:17 am
..that preferably results in a parliamentary system.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 5:57 pm
The US was the first attempt at democracy. First attempts are not always the best ones. Major reforms were undertaken at least three times. The constitutional convention, the American Bill of Rights and lastly the Fourteenth Amendment which gave the first ten “teeth” for the first time.
There is something to be said for a 21st century equivalent of those reforms…
John Nachtigall Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 6:05 pm
What is the fascination with the parliamentary system. It has advantage and disadvantages. I fail to see how it is superior. Failures,to form governments in times of stress (when you need one the most) is a real structural problem.
EJ Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 6:17 pm
I don’t get the appeal of a parliamentary system. We just force the ruling coalition to get together in a political party before the election, instead of (hopefully) sorting it out afterwards.
EJ Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 6:18 pm
By “we” I mean our much maligned two party system.
Eric Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 9:25 am
I’d be in favor of any system where gerrymandering is impossible, that doesn’t elect the wrong person 10% of the time or so, and money isn’t speech.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:09 pm
In a two party system many people end up unrepresented…
The optimal system would be a parliament that represents everybody with no permanent majority. Currently almost all parliamentary systems have a certain number of MPs whose votes won’t ever matter (usually those outside the coalition). On the other hand a coalition agreement can force opinions on parties that don’t share them. And that’s how you get coal subsidies favored by the Greens (to placate the Social Democrats and their Union base) or whatever crazy thing the CSU is demanding…
Unfortunately, Presidential systems are prone to Presidential abuse and ending up as dictatorships… Few Presidential regimes have lasted…
EJ Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:57 am
The most viable third party in the US would be a far right fascist party. Be careful what you wish for.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 5:55 pm
[citation needed]
Joe Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 6:05 pm
http://convention.gop
EJ Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 6:11 pm
Got no citation (it’s not my original idea, I’m just too lazy to look it up), but the main reason we don’t have a large far right party now is that that GOP does a much better job of accommodating the far right than the Dems do with the far left. Though it’s rather blown up in the GOP’s face this election…
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:12 pm
The GOP under Trump is indistinguishable from a far right party…
Danny Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 12:35 pm
Duverger’s law has been debunked harder than phlogiston theory
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 5:55 pm
If that is as you state, you can surely enlighten us as to why parliamentary systems tend to have more nationwide parties than First Past the Post…
Of course regional parties like the SNP in Scotland or the Quebec separatists benefit from FPTP, but they are not national parties…
Aarond Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 2:58 pm
I wouldn’t be so quick to write it off. HSR is a thing that can be built and that people can use, and as such it can be used as a way to “demonstrate” a politician’s vision.
Also, Mike Pence (Trump’s rumored VP) did support Wolverine improvements in Northern Indiana:
http://www.nwitimes.com/business/transportation/pence-touts-indiana-gateway-high-speed-rail-link/article_c9102afd-7304-50ec-812e-d20093a724c9.html
http://ccrail.com/indot-indiana-gateway/
Gringrich has vocalized support for HSR as well.
adirondacker12800 Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 3:40 pm
The Newtster bloviates on all sorts of subjects.
One of my favorites, from 2012, is that gasoline would be 10 bucks a gallon if Obama was reelected.
http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2015/01/01/3607416/4-things-2015-obama-reelected/
But then all Republicans spend a great deal of time convincing themselves that Democrats are evil. When they aren’t busy shoving big government into people’s bedrooms.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 6:03 pm
What about the moon colony petitioning to be a state by his third term?
Danny Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 12:35 pm
frankly I’m surprised Toffler fan Gingrich hasn’t demanded a few billion investment for the MuskPod
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 6:00 pm
Maybe a Hyped Loop on Mars? Built with by the money earned through Laffer curve tax cuts…
Jerry Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 12:43 pm
From the article:
“Pence also praised Amtrak officials and others for helping keep the Hoosier State Amtrak route running in Indiana.
Norfolk Southern railroad’s efforts also were key to making the Indiana Gateway into reality, Pence said.”
Hyperloop would have been a much better MacGuffin for True Detective Season 2 than CAHSR.
synonymouse Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 12:12 am
The Hypeloop is no stupider than monorails.
Just watch the morning news. Quotidian California is more “noir” than any Hollywood detective story could ever dream up.
Wells Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 8:00 am
I love the word stupider.
But there’s stupider,
and then there’s stupider.
Stupiders leading to more
and more and more stupiders.
When will the stupiders stop!?
Wells Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 3:11 pm
edited:
But there’s stupider,
and then there’s stupider.
Stupiders leading to more
and more stupider stupiders.
More stupiders leading to
more stupider stupider stupiders!
When will the stupiders! STOP!!?
EJ Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 5:54 pm
Again with the monorails? Who’s building a monorail in California?
Car(e)-Free LA Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:30 pm
Nobody.
Tokkyu40 Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 8:36 pm
“The Hypeloop is no stupider than monorails.”
Monorails are proven technology. They work well for what they do, which is why Japan keeps building new ones. They also keep extending the Shinkansen.
What works, works.
synonymouse Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:15 pm
Cable cars work well for what they do.
Car(e)-Free LA Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:30 pm
So?
synonymouse Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 12:21 am
The devil did not invent gadgetbahns; the highway lobby did.
A diversionary tactic to fend off electric rail, always seen as the natural and historic enemy of the automobile.
EJ Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 5:24 am
Why are you talking about monorails? Nobody is building a monorail in California.
synonymouse Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 10:10 am
Monorail wetdreams helped to kill streetcars on Katella.
Unlike maglev or the dreaded HypeLoop, monorails represent no new tech. Just trolley bus trains on a guideway. Rubber-tyre.
Even the tourist angle is moribund – why did HART not go for monorail? Driverless attracted them the most.
Car(e)-Free LA Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 2:48 pm
Streetcars on Patella shouldn’t be built–they have no point. It’s good they weren’t built, because now OCTA and Metro can partner on extending the West Santa Ana Branch Corridor to ARTIC via Disneyland.
Eric Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 5:00 pm
what monorail is Japan building?
That engineering became a sideshow to marketing exercises. I’d go further and replace “had become” with “always was.”’ The hyperloop is mere hype, a marketing exercise with toy engineering as a sideshow. It’s a barf comet raising suspicions about what’s going on:
“I sense a bit of hucksterism right now that’s helping companies raise money,” says Ralph Hollis, a research professor of robotics at Carnegie Mellon, an expert on maglev tech. I sense it too. This lawsuit indeed seems to confirm that diagnosis. If the hyperloop was feasible, it would be cool. But it’s not/nether. So stop wasting time and money on it and get back to work on HSR up and running as soon as possible.”
Come to think of it, Central Valley was the best starting point; politically forcing both north/south interests, dragged kicking and screaming, and IMO, creating controversy with incompetent route arrangement procedural planning processes and rude politics. Altamont. Period. Palmdale meantime, invest in slower passenger-rail corridor. Try out the Talgo new cab and locomotive. Pick your own colors. 200+MPH is only viable through the once quiet valley nights. Blended is fine. Just please slow your smarty pants britches down. Join my club:
The Autonomous Self-Driving CLOWN CAR Bandwagon
or ASCB (pronounced ASS-BE)
(^:
OT Slide 18 CP 2-3 Open House 2016
CP 2-3 Project has been divided into 3 segments
Segment 1 (North)
19.1 miles
HSR Structure: 0.79 miles
Highway Overpasses: 12
Embankment: ~4.7 million CY
Segment 2
20.3 miles
HSR Structure: 0.9 miles
Highway Overpasses: 15
Embankment: ~4.7 million CY
Segment 3 (South)
26.1 miles
HSR Structure: 0.92 miles
Highway Overpasses: 5
Embankment: ~4.2 million CY
http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/business/single-view/view/sinara-and-crrc-sign-russian-high-speed-train-agreement.html
This blog reminds me of what the Frogs had to say about the Wright Brothers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wright_brothers#European_skepticism.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 6:06 pm
The Wright Brothers did not say they can deliver a plane for a tenth of the price of a train ticket in a fifth the time.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence
Danny Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 11:56 am
that’s what Paul Moller says, too
EJ Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 10:00 am
“People were also skeptical about [insert other completely different technology]” is a completely meaningless statement. It’s the same as every crank pseudo-scientist who insists “but they also said Galileo was wrong!”
Danny Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 12:40 pm
heck, Galileo didn’t have a shred of evidence to separate his model from Tycho’s: he was Semmelweised after pissing everyone off
but the legendarium built around Galileo and Copernicus and Columbus is integral to American myth, from Twain to Heinlein to Musk–America NEEDS to believe in the Great Men who Changed the World and Gave Us Our Modernity against jeering flat-earthers and frightened mobs with torches and pitchforks
there’s no room for Otto Lilenthals in this monument-friendly view of invention
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 6:07 pm
Were you looking for http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Galileo_Gambit this?
Danny Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 11:18 am
“Rational”Wiki is made entirely of Galileo gambits
Faber Castell Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 11:53 am
Hmmmm
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:15 pm
What’s your criticism of Rationalwiki? Too many “SJWs”? Too critical of religion?
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 6:06 pm
The guy you should be going for is Alfred Wegener: Expert in the “wrong field” (Climatology not Geology or Geography) and his hypothesis of continental drift had severe holes when he proposed it (what makes the continents move? for example) yet he was still right and had a handful of things to back it up (some of them from his climatologist field of expertise). He was still laughed out of the room by the extremely conservative science establishment…
EJ Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 5:26 am
I know who Wegener was. Way to completely miss the point.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:16 pm
I got your point, I mean that the Galileo thing should have been replaced by someone else by now…
Message to the San Carlos mafia re http://www.caltrain.com/Page4493.aspx.
The train that needs upgrading from 5-car Gallery to 6-car Bombardier is
NB319 (https://twitter.com/hashtag/NB319?src=hash),
NOT NB217 (https://twitter.com/hashtag/NB217?src=hash)
THIS WILL BE THE LAST AND FINAL WARNING ON THIS ISSUE.
Car(e)-Free LA Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 3:02 pm
Judging from the past few posts, I think Roland will join ISIS if the RSMFRs don’t fix Caltrain fast.
Roland Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 3:17 pm
Civilized people do not have to resort to violence to achieve their objectives.
car(e)-free LA Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 3:52 pm
Civilized people to not make threats to transit agencies (even if they are RSMFRs) on obscure transit blogs.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 6:08 pm
“Civilized people” is an awfully overbroad concept…
Roland Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 6:37 pm
There is a difference between a threat and a promise.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 6:51 pm
Depends…
Zorro Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 12:12 pm
Diapers, yep anti-HSR types do need them changed…
LOL
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:18 pm
Because they are OLD
Wells Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 3:20 pm
If ever his sister said she’s not his I-Sis shut up, already. Better left unsaid,
worthy electrification/rail crossing upgrades, ya know like whatever,
would be alright, pretty much okay?
car(e)-free LA Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 3:52 pm
???
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 6:10 pm
Am I the only one around here who did not understand a single word?
Roland Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 6:39 pm
https://youtu.be/1dhaIJpfG-g
Ted K. Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 6:40 pm
Shakespeare translated to Valley-speak ?
I prefer the “Digging of the We-ans”.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 15th, 2016 at 6:52 pm
Like Friends, Romans and uhm… Country-you know-men I’m like totally not come to bury Caesar but to, you know burry him. Like totally. Oh my gawd….
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 6:08 pm
One of the buries is supposed to be “praise”. Oh my. My Shakespeare used to be better. Sic transit gloria mundi…
Wells Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 11:53 am
Sorry, one of my loose thought trains in humor/sarcasm.
IOW, please don’t add the ills of Isis to the railway discussion.
Just learning that most of the trees to be cut are “Trees of Heaven”
and probably would be replaced with some similarly shady tree,
is an idea even my head won’t have trouble with. My job is killing me.
I finally looked at the electrification tree impact map covering Atherton’s city limits.
I counted all trees to be either 50% or 100% removed. They are all adjacent to northbound main track #1, and I’d have to go check, but I suspect many are probably invasive Ailanthus “tree of heaven” (aka “stinking sumac”). These fast-growing trees thrive on neglect and grow like weeds along the ROW in the Menlo-Atherton area. Their wood is quite soft and I’ve removed a couple myself with a hand saw.
So here’s my tally:
remove 50% = 86 trees (18 are adjacent to Holbrook Palmer Park)
remove 100% = 15 (3 are adjacent to Holbrook Palmer Park)
So Caltrain is really only proposing to fully remove 12 trees bordering Atherton private properties.
While that might sound like a lot of trees, it’s really just a tempest in a teapot pretense for Atherton to raise a stink about HSR-enabling electrification.
Roland Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 12:40 am
Why would anyone in their right mind consider electrifying this piece of crap https://youtu.be/VwD2xOmNnqs?t=1314? How about putting the tracks back where they were 150 years ago (AKA in the middle of the ROW) instead of messing with Atherton’s trees?
J. Wong Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 2:59 am
Exactly what is the video supposed to show? It’s just a northbound run from before Atherton to San Francisco of a commuter railroad. What would you rather do than electrification? Spend the money on more train sets that’d more slowly transport you in comfort because they can increase the throughput? (Plus permanently blocking all grade crossings since the gates would be down all day.)
J. Wong Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 3:00 am
“Can’t ” increase.
Roland Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 7:16 am
Can someone please help this man?
Joe Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 9:05 am
Why? Because you posted a dull video and now can’t explain why it was important.
I’ve had the same experience. I watch a link and think “what the hell ?”
Tell him yourself.
LA Times: Thorny issues challenge California’s commitment to
Of importance to High Speed Rail, is the final paragraph in this article.
Newsome most likely by far to succeed Brown, again reiterates his opposition to o HSR. Others who will also attempt to become the next Governor, are likely to do the same.
Roland Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 7:19 am
Did you forget to mention the likely next President of the United States who is reported to actually know what she is talking about?
Joe Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 9:11 am
Help me Newsom-Wan. You’re our only hope.
Newsom isn’t anti HSR. You can’t pull a quote to that effect.
morris brown Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 9:18 am
Newsom not anti-HSR… are you NUTS (actually I know you are)…
California high-speed rail dealt blow by Newsom’s about-face
Joe Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 9:22 am
Nuts is when a pot smoking, gay marrying liberal is your only hope.
There is a Major difference between opposing high speed rail – he does not – and criticizing the specific project plan and project under construction.
Joe Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 9:25 am
Oops
Headlines are written by editor a seeking attention.
The article you cite.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 6:13 pm
More than once commentators on this blog have said “He will do some minor things with HSR and then claim to have “saved” it”… I am increasingly thinking this more plausible than him killing it.
Car(e)-Free LA Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:31 pm
Our only hope is Villaraigosa.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:18 pm
Why?
HSR fast pass: Chinese trains pass at 420 kph (261 mph) in opposite directions
Clem Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 11:58 am
Previous record was 777 km/h closing speed on the LGV Est in France.
Eric Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 5:07 pm
was expecting video…
pictures don’t really confer a sensation of speed :)
Italy expects to sign $1.1b deal to build first stretch HSR in Iran
agb5 Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 2:58 am
Somewhat similar in distance and terrain, but not price, to Bakersfield -> Palmdale.
les Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 12:33 pm
I can’t imagine anything to build in Iran is too expensive.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 6:14 pm
Well it’s kinda hard to get cranes, given the regime mostly uses them to hang gay teenagers…
The “Autonomous Self-Driving CLOWN CAR Bandwagon”
or ASCB (pronounced ASS-BE) :^)
Guy gets into his self-driving car, says “Destination 48 please.”
Self-driving car responds “No. Every time you eat at a drive-thru
the greasy wet garbage gets tossed on the rear seat, violating the terms
of legal agreement. You can walk, fat ass litterbug.”
Zorro Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 12:19 pm
OUCH!
Car(e)-Free LA Reply:
July 16th, 2016 at 9:59 pm
I like it.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 6:15 pm
nice one!
http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/news/europe/single-view/view/hs2-ltd-proposes-south-yorkshire-route-revision.html
OT: Breaking News: Gilroy ridership explodes!!!
“The swap will occur July 25 on trains going to and coming from Gilroy, Calif. These trains were chosen because they regularly are overcrowded with riders, Caltrain officials said in a press release”
http://www.progressiverailroading.com/mechanical/article/Caltrain-to-swap-train-sets-to-relieve-crowding-perform-maintenance–48806
OT: Quiz of the Week:
Q: What does Virgin get for $550K?
A: A fresh Pendolino paint job
http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/traction-rolling-stock/single-view/view/alstom-to-repaint-pendolino-fleet.html
Q: What does Caltrain get for $550K?
A: A single door set (total 4 per car) that will not be prized open until the year 2050
http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/passenger/single-view/view/san-francisco-san-jose-electrification-and-emu-contracts-approved.html
Clem Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 12:07 am
The dual boarding height configuration accounts for $30 million out of the $551M EMU contract. That is 5% of the vehicle cost, and includes 96×4 door sets, 96×4 extensible gap filler step mechanisms, 16 in-vehicle wheelchair lifts, non-recurring engineering of the car shell, and door control system (hardware and software) to make it all play.
If a single pair of doors cost $550k as Roland claims, the expense for dual boarding heights would be $0.55M per door * 4 extra doors/car * 96 cars = $211 million plus the cost of all the other items required for future level boarding.
Roland is surely not completely innumerate, so additional explanation of his accounting methods is warranted. $200 million is indeed the cost premium that can be attributed to Caltrain’s onerous RFP requirements and Stadler’s pricing leverage as the sole bidder (when comparing to a recent Swedish order for a Stadler KISS fleet).
Out of this $200 million premium, $30 million accounts for dual boarding heights, a relatively affordable amount given the importance of transitioning to level boarding over the next decade or two. The remaining $170 million pays for Buy America compliance, FRA regulatory compliance, other unusual Caltrain requirements, and sole-bidder profit, none of which are items to which the Swedish KISS order was subject.
We live in the richest region of the richest state of the richest country on Earth. We can afford this.
synonymouse Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 12:45 am
And if you are not living the dream, there’s always Columbus.
Joe Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 10:27 am
So Roland is attributing all additional costs to the dual doors. If we remove these doors the cost would not drop 550 per door. We’d save a small amount and add a few more seats.
Clem Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 12:41 pm
We would “save” $30M and pay through the nose later to transition to level boarding later, most likely by duplicating platforms at all stations, or by whatever astronomically expensive solution people can come up with.
The trains were ordered with seats in front of the high doors, so with ~550 seats per six-car set, not the ~450 seat figure after the high doors are put into use. Once the transition to high platforms is complete, the low doors are retired and ~550 seats capacity restored.
Joe Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 2:20 pm
Right.
So once the transition to higher platforms is complete, the lower doors will be removed and seats added. Transition can happen as stations are upgraded or in the case of Atherton, closed forever.
Possibly the current, temporary configuration as planned will have more standing room and thus more capacity.
Neil Shea Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 2:54 pm
So happy that dual door cars are being ordered to transition to a common platform height
Joe Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 4:16 pm
Next trick is for SF to find a practical way to extend Caltain to the HSR compatible Transbay Terminal.
Jerry Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 5:34 pm
I don’t think that Penn & Teller would even want to try that, “trick.”
Joe Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 8:12 pm
Possible with next administration.
Powerful SF based Congress women Nancy Pelosi is 74, same age as the retiring Barbara Boxer. Any multi-billion dollar grant to bring Caltrain/HSR to TBT has to come in the next few years.
Seniority matters. She has clout. Boxer’s senate replacement will be junior and Feinstein is no spring chicken.
Danny Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 11:16 am
funnily Penn & Teller are Catoids, so if they get involved in rail they’ll just ride a metro at 2 am and note how deserted it is, complain about vegans riding it, say it cost $6 trillion, and insist that science only supports one-person cars on freeways forever and ever
Faber Castell Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 11:55 am
catoids?
Car(e)-Free LA Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 2:50 pm
Why?
Roland Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 10:39 pm
I am experiencing difficulties understanding how ending up with 200 seats less than what we had 15 years earlier is going to work but then again I am not a rocket scientist…
J. Wong Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 6:36 am
1st it’s 100 seats not 200. 2nd standing room on the bi-levels is more then on the gallery cars.
Roland Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 6:59 am
Wong again: 762-200=562 (12 more than after “adding” back the 100 lost seats which will NEVER happen).
Joe Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 9:07 am
Guy who bitches the cost of dual doors is at it again.
Capacity is best measured by people per unit time and not seats per train.
Roland Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 3:53 pm
Guy who has his head so far up his whatsit that he is turning purple is at it again:
http://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/transport/virgin-trains-edinburgh-london-service-adds-22-000-seats-1-4030629
Joe Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 4:27 pm
Train-iffic comeback.
What matters is how many more people electrified Caltrain can potentially move during commute hours. Focusing on doors and seats for one train misses the mark.
Clem Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 6:01 pm
He does have a good point that the new fleet lacks seating capacity, something that can be remedied up front by procuring eight-car trains with five-abreast seating.
Joe Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 6:26 pm
Sure. We can maximize seating with more cars with some not opening at short platforms.
Add a middle seat.
Reduce bike capacity.
But that doesn’t change the fact Caltrain should and can run more trains per hour.
EJ Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 6:44 pm
“Reduce bike capacity.”
You’re like a dog with a bone.
Clem Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 6:44 pm
Should, can and will!
Joe Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 7:31 pm
@EJ or a like local dependent on Caltrain with a legitimate opinion. You on the other hand live where ?? and ride how often?? But nice to see you have opinions.
@Clem – hopeful. As you noted, the techs that put that dual door briefing together didn’t mention the schedule benefits of level boarding. I think CHSRA will providing some insight or oversight into how the ROW can be maximized.
EJ Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 7:47 pm
@Joe
I live in San Diego, so, no, don’t use Caltrain. But people like you are an unfortunate constant everywhere. You view life as fundamentally a zero-sum game. There are clearly solutions that accommodate both bicyclists and give Caltrain more seated capacity. But you’ve little interest in that.
Joe Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 8:19 pm
Caltrain has most permissive bike policy of any commuter system. Policy rigid for peak commute – not like London or BART or Chicago metro.
People like me want more room for people.
Bikes welcome too.
Bike riders can buy a folding bike and carry it on Caltrain anywhere. Anywhere and no bumping ever. $299 at Costco with 8’speeds or more elaborate models.
EJ Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 10:16 am
Those systems lack the capacity for longer or more frequent trains, Caltrain does not.
Joe Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 12:09 pm
@EJ if BART lacks capacity then why are they adding more cars to improve capacity? In fact they are adding more cars and each with more standing room. Rules allow bikes but not if train is full. Sensible and if applied to Caltrain Bullet would allow more riders in bike standing area.
Chicago Metra is not at capacity, some lines have lost ridership.
synonymouse Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 12:21 pm
in re BART
ADA does not apply to cattle and/or refrigerators.
EJ Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 1:12 pm
@Joe AFAIK BART is adding more cars to ultimately replace the oldest ones in their fleet, and to create more capacity by reducing seats in favor of standees. I was under the impression that during rush hour the transbay line runs all 10 car sets at pretty much the minimum headway.
As for Metra, if they can take bikes during rush hour, why don’t they? That seems like poor customer service.
Getting back to Caltrain, it’s far from clear to me that they couldn’t accomodate their existing loads and bikes by adding more cars and more frequent trains. Maybe you know different.
adirondacker12800 Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 1:18 pm
Chicagoans don’t get the urge to drag their bikes along with them everywhere, so it’s not a problem?
Joey Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 1:31 pm
Any capacity increases to BART at this point are marginal. There are a small number of rush hour trains that are not 10 cars (mostly due to lack of/aging rolling stock), and perhaps a couple of trains per hour can be added through signaling improvements. It’s incredibly expensive to lengthen stations because they’re in tunnels. Many BART trains are beyond their standing capacity. As such, their new rolling stock will remove seats to make more room for standees.
Caltrain is crowded but nowhere near this point. Additional cars per train and additional trans per hour can both be added easily at this point.
That being said, Caltrain could be doing more to reduce the demand for bicycles on board the train. Example: secure bike lockers at stations.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:21 pm
So how could BART possibly add capacity?
Ted K. Reply:
July 21st, 2016 at 3:11 pm
They can’t add capacity at this time. The signal system doesn’t have spare slots during peak periods, the most heavily used stations (e.g. Embarcadero, Montgomery) are near crowd control limits, and pocket tracks were left out of the system design at several key locations.
Signal system – Upgrade being planned, will take years and money (10**8, 10**9 $’s)
Suggestion : Treat BART as a freight RR since they’re running cattle cars for two-legged cattle. Add RFID tags to all of their cars. Then add scanners to read those tags that report via Wi-Fi or cellular radio in the downtowns of Oakland and SF. Use that as input to a study for an overlay system.
Maxed stations – Montgomery and Embarcadero have been closed at times due to too many people on the platform. That’s why they’re considering adding side platforms, what I call chipmunk cheeks, to the existing island platforms at those stations.
Pocket tracks – Various systems around the world have places to stash a consist in case of breakdowns or as a reserve. BUT NOT BART. The most needed is in downtown SF west of the Civic Center Station. A couple more could be in downtown Oakland (e.g. MacArthur, 12th Street). South Oakland isn’t that far from the Hayward Yard.
The nicest thing I can say about BART is that they are a victim of their own success. But that success is highlighting their many design mistakes. And yes, they could take out a few more seats but that would run up against the wide span of the system and HVAC issues.
agb5 Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 2:13 am
The article says the paint job costs $30.9k
Ben in SF Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 11:01 am
Maybe the higher amount was before the pound’s value against the dollar plummeted?
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 6:16 pm
What’s it right now? A milliard to the cent?
Ted K. Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 8:16 pm
A milliard of which coin (choose from : farthing, half pence, pence, tuppence, threepence, sixpence, shilling, florin, half crown, crown, half sovereign, sovereign, or guinea) ?
http://www.merriam-webster.com/table/collegiate/number.htm
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_British_banknotes_and_coins
P.S. I’m assuming that Bahnfreund omitted the “(U.S.)” after the “cent” in his comment.
Ted K. Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 8:47 pm
NB – American money was decimal with a Spanish component. That’s why we have the bit (archaic, 1/8 dollar, from pieces-of-eight), quarter, and half-dollar.
British money before they went decimal was a 12 x 20 framework. So my list above translates to the niches (not values) :
(farthing – tuppence) – 2.5 mills, 5 mills, penny, double penny;
(threepence – florin) – quarter-shilling, half-shilling, shilling, double shilling;
(half crown – guinea) – bit, quarter, half, full, full+ (gold).
Americans, but not the U.S., had their own shillings :
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shilling#Northern_America
Ted K. Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 10:48 pm
s/shilling, double shilling;/shilling (1/20 or nickel), double shilling (1/10 or dime);/
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:24 pm
Who ever came up with this system and thought it was logical easy to understand or somehow better than simply dividing by tens and hundreds?
Roland Reply:
July 21st, 2016 at 2:09 am
The British converted their currency to metric on 2/15/71: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decimal_Day
Ted K. Reply:
July 21st, 2016 at 3:04 am
The roots of the old, pre-decimal coinage date back to the Roman occupation of Britain. It evolved over the centuries to what seems like a confusing muddle. But note the binary pattern in each of the three segments (pence / shilling / crown – sov.). It’s like the pattern in liquid measurements (pint / quart / half-gallon / gallon).
But what if there were a social class element to the coins ? The peasants would mostly use pence and a few shillings. The middle class would use shillings with some overlap to the sides. And the gentry would use half-crowns through guineas with shillings for change. That would simplify things for everybody except for the accountants.
My mnemonic for the old coinage ties to a brief period when the pound sterling was worth $2.40 US. Then it was a straight conversion : 1 pence = 1 cent; 1 shilling = 12 cents; 1 pound = $2.40; and a golden guinea = $2.52 . Guineas were of interest to me both as war-time bribes and their use in various novels (Hornblower, James Bond, etc.).
Ted K. Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 9:03 pm
Mill = tenth of a cent, archaic U.S. coinage
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mill_(currency)
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:23 pm
There actually once was a halfcent coin…
It was withdrawn due to its utter uselessness. At the time of its withdrawal it was worth way more than the cent is now…
Ted K. Reply:
July 21st, 2016 at 3:33 am
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coins_of_the_United_States_dollar
And for those with way too much time on their hands :
http://www.usmint.gov/education/historianscorner/
http://www.royalmint.com/aboutus/our-history
NB – I’m using this link as a compromise. One can click to either the current Royal Mint or to their museum. Happy clicking.
Roland Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 8:29 pm
https://www.google.com/search?q=eur+usd
OT: SpaceX launch at 9.45 PM PST: https://youtu.be/ThIdCuSsJh8
Q: Why does it matter?
A: Because the Tesla Master product plan is next if all goes as well as expected tonight: https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/754772663365664768
Ted K. Reply:
July 17th, 2016 at 10:57 pm
More links :
https://www.theguardian.com/science/2016/jul/18/spacex-launches-new-style-space-docking-port-into-orbit
https://techcrunch.com/2016/07/17/spacex-successfully-brings-a-rocket-back-to-land-for-the-second-time/
Roland Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 12:41 am
Update: https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/754931091891453952
Roland Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 7:01 am
Update #2: https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/754968472929574912
Joe Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 7:37 am
Did you get hire to retweet musk’s pointless Twitter posts?
Roland Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 8:23 am
Did you get hired by Trump to post useless comments all day long?
Joe Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 9:01 am
Oh snap.
What’s Elon having for breakfast? Can you post a video of your train commute today?
Roland Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 2:19 pm
Ding. Ding.
Joe Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 2:42 pm
Any Twitter update?
Roland Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 2:47 pm
https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/718273532438966274/j0h7TkOS.jpg
Joe Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 4:28 pm
Well played.
Roland Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 8:50 pm
Ring. Ring.
Hi Joece, this is Elon. My Daddy needs to get some work done with his friends. Would you like to meet outside and play?
Joe Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 9:05 pm
…Still nothing ….
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:26 pm
I recently watched “the social network” (one of the few works of Sorkin I had not yet watched, and yes I even gave studio 60 a chance…) Somehow I can’t help but think that Elon Musk is not much different from the people in that movie… A bit better dressed maybe. And a bit less talented. But no less of an utter douchebag…
Roland Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:54 pm
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/755841606960373760
O.T. L.A. ‘Subway to the Sea’ is less about play more about work
For those who believe L.A. car culture will never change, guess what? It is.
Car(e)-Free LA Reply:
July 18th, 2016 at 2:52 pm
Except they stereotype the corridor as being full of yoga studios, juice bars, and auto body shops. I’m pretty sure there aren’t many of them along the line.
EJ Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 2:13 pm
Big chunks of it are 2 and 3 story apartment buildings – pretty typical of much of LA. It’s been called “dense sprawl.”
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:27 pm
There’s probably more “up and coming actors” than any of the things you mentioned along that line ;-)
Well, KPMG have bought into the hyperloop hype, they claim there is no obstacle to 1000kmh speeds, intermediate stations and 10 seconds pod frequency.
http://500kmh.com/Hyperloop_Shares/160704-HyperloopOne-FSLinks_KPMG-presentation.pdf
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:29 pm
KPMG are physics and engineering experts since..?
SpaceX delays Hyperloop Competition to January 2017: http://fortune.com/2016/07/16/spacex-delays-hyperloop-pod-competition-to-2017/
Roland Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 1:55 am
https://www.reddit.com/r/spacex/comments/4t3z8m/spacex_is_delaying_its_hyperloop_pod_contest/
Metrolink unveils new locomotives that could help improve the region’s air
So with better performance how do these locomotives compare with EMUs in acceleration, which was supposedly a huge reason for Caltrain to go electric at a very high capital cost.
Aarond Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 6:59 am
EMUs offer better acceleration/deceleration due to distributed power. More powered wheels means less weight each individual power wheel has to move. A better question would be DMUs vs EMUs, not loco-hauled trainsets vs EMUs.
Also, to play devil’s advocate: an even better question would be comparing third rail DC power vs AC power electrification.
morris brown Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 7:21 am
Third rail power is not an option, since CHSRA is paying and only overhead power is compatible with HSR train sets.
EJ Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 9:56 am
Third rail power also has about the same capital costs as OHLE, since the lower voltage means the transmission and distribution infrastructure is more extensive. In addition it offers lower performance at high speeds.
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:30 pm
Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t one of the main advantages of third rail that it takes less space (hence its use for subways) and thus sometimes allows cheaper operation?
Reality Check Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 5:28 pm
With Rigid Overhead Conductor Rail System (ROCS) for narrow tunnels, high reliability and for special applications, I don’t think 3rd rail has much clearance advantage anymore. Panama City’s brand new subway uses it instead of 3rd rail despite being a predominantly underground system.
Max Wyss Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 4:51 pm
As already stated, third rail power is extremely limited when it comes to high power requirements. Maximum voltage (I know about) is 1500 V (the Maurienne third rail electrification). The vehicles might be a tad cheaper, but the infrastructure is much more expensive than overhead wires and AC. Ah, yeah, and there is the high chance of the wrong kind of leaves and snow…
Bahnfreund Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:31 pm
Plus it tends to limit speeds.
Not to an amount that commuter operations would care, but to an amount that it does not gel with HSR…
Joe Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 7:17 am
Air quality and noise are other benefits.
Clem did the math on improved performance with dwell time and DMU acceleration.
http://caltrain-hsr.blogspot.com/2016/05/caltrain-has-dwell-time-problem.html?m=1
Clem Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 10:03 am
The acceleration performance of a train is best measured in kW/ton (power to weight ratio)
The new Metrolink locomotives weigh a porky 127 metric tons, and put out just 3100 kW at the wheels (and that’s being generous, not counting any power loss for air conditioning and lighting). With six Bombardier cars and 1000 passengers, the power-to-weight ratio comes out to 6.4 kW/ton, probably a bit less after accounting for “hotel power”.
Caltrain’s new EMUs will weigh about 300 tons for a six-car set, and are rated at 4000 kW (continuous rating). With the same 1000 passenger load, the power-to-weight ratio is 11.1 kW/ton, or 73% higher than Metrolink’s super diesel. And that’s not all: EMUs can briefly exceed their continuous power rating, such as for accelerating out of a station. The Stadler KISS Caltrain just bought is rated at 6000 kW short term, giving a power-to-weight ratio of 16.7 kW/ton. That is 160% more acceleration than Metrolink’s super diesel, and on the same performance level as BART. If you’ve ever been on BART, you’ve surely felt how swiftly it accelerates.
When you add more cars to the trains, the diesel gets even slower. The EMU does not.
Short answer: diesels will always suck, and Caltrain made the right choice to go electric even at very high capital cost.
Paul Dyson Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 1:12 pm
Clem, you underplay the hotel power consumption. I’ve been reliably informed it can reduce the available power at the wheels by 25%, especially with a long train on a hot day. Both Metrolink and the manufacturers and misinforming the public about this, not to mention the lack of standby if the prime mover fails.
Paul Dyson Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 1:14 pm
To add to my comment above, in steam days UK railways had summer and winter timetables to allow for the power loss from steam heating. The first diesels carried steam boilers so no power loss, but later these were replaced by ETH (electric train heat) so in some cases winter timetables were re-introduced or at least widely discussed in scheduling circles.
Wells Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 5:38 pm
Self-driving car jokes suddenly got old that day one killed a Florida man,
now blamed his own accident victim for violating terms of lease:
Trusting robocar would not crash when attention distracted from hands-on steering.
Yesterday, walking past a space-cadet Cadillac scowling at my presence.
Parked by a basement poker palace posing an imposing presence.
I’m richer than you it screamed! And while my ears ringed I passed,
looked behind and a perfectly placed bumper sticker read:
MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN.
Forced to check my bias at the door.
I devised the next self-driving car joke:
Man steps into his Robocar and says “Destination 42b please.”
Roborcar responds, “No.”
Roland Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 2:17 pm
This quest of “power for the sake of power” and “acceleration” is what got us into this perfect storm whereby there is no way the CalFranKISSenTrains will ever be able to carry 120K passengers/day once the DTX opens let alone twice as many again when the new Transbay tube opens.
Adding traction power as and when needed (starting off with diesels during construction) to an EMU has NEVER been a problem. The REAL challenge is achieving sufficient bike/seat/toilet capacity within the existing infrastructure constraints (AKA “length between couplers” within existing platform lengths) and that is precisely why THE STADLER KISS SHOULD NEVER HAVE MADE IT TO THE CALTRAIN SHORTLIST, let alone justify in excess of $200M in FTA funds to achieve FRA “certification” (why should WE have to pay for this???).
Going back to Caltrain “electrification”, a good place to start would be with tracks that look like these: https://youtu.be/_kaIek9TA6k (yes, ladies and gentlemen, that REALLY is a DMU accelerating out of Banbury station).
Here is how they got there in 20 months with $1B of PRIVATE capital: https://youtu.be/6PdTr06tIlA?t=399. There are no immediate plans for electrification: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chiltern_Main_Line#Electrification
Joey Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 4:12 pm
The plan is Electrify -> Transition to EMUs -> Transition to high platforms
Your brilliant alternative plan is ???
Joe Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 6:27 pm
I agree. There’s nothing but complaining and a focus on per car seating.
Clem’s shown how faster acceleration and level boarding can increase track capacity and the number of trains per hour
Additional EMUs are possible Up to 8 per train.
The EMUs will have fewer seats due to dual doors but more room for standing and thus more people.
Paul Dyson Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 6:32 pm
Everybody loves standing for an hour
Joe Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 8:51 pm
No. I don’t like standing but the dual door offers the room. I would have problems if I tried that long but the system needs capacity.
Roland Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 10:25 pm
Sorry, no seats left for Gilroy passengers at Tamien. You can just stay on the nice Gilroy 6-car Bombardier local to Palo Alto if you want a seat. BTW, expect these Bombardiers to be around for at least another 15 years once the RSMFRs figure out that they have completely fucked up the EMU procurement at which point we will just have to buy some nice Siemens electric locomotives to lug Bombardiers to Transbay.
CBO$$!!! Jobs!!! Par-Tay!!!
Joe Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 10:55 pm
Bizarre.
Gilroy riders Transfer at tamien today onto Bullet and there are seats. Transfer to electrified Caltrain at
Tamien in the future will offwr more frequent service and subsequently more seats available.
Roland Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 11:05 pm
Did you forget that a CalFICKISSenTrain has 300 seats less than the trains currently waiting @ Tamien? If so, the solution is simple: just wait on the platform for the next one and hope that it won’t be full by the time it gets there.
Miles Bader Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 7:15 pm
You have to remember that Roland’s base motivation is that he’s a euro-fanboy, and wants low platforms because Europe has them (same with Mylarnik). Everything else is frantic handwaving attempting to justify that underlying bias.
Roland Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 9:47 pm
Low platforms come with the bi-level territory (nothing to do with Europe per se).
High platforms on the other hand have everything to do with “opportunities”
http://tinyurl.com/ohog8gx (bottom of page 3), starting with 9,600 “jobs” in San Mateo County: https://youtu.be/_a-3nMwjtPI
Michael Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 9:54 pm
Today’s Caltrain platforms aren’t level with anything. So to get level boarding, platforms will be rebuilt. The cost of rebuilding at one height or another isn’t a big difference, it’s all the planning, design, temporary fixes, etc. So if level boarding is to happen at any level, it’ll cost money, require workers (jobs), and require time.
Roland Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 10:13 pm
Everybody wants to get to level boarding (really!) but the question is at what height. If we start with 22 inches, passengers will still be able to board from 8″ platforms without another set of doors (just like they do now). Whether we will ever go from 22 inches to 50 in the next 30 years is TBD but less and less likely as years go by (most countries with high platforms are going in the opposite direction).
Joe Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 10:29 pm
oh noes! You have a palantir and gaze into and see a future. Evil Sauro- Mlynarik fools weak minded with false visions.
We electrify Caltrain now with HSR money and commitment to blended service. Now you say that HSR doesn’t matter because it will take decades. Well fool, now give back the HSR money.
Clem’s blog tells us HSR platforms are not getting smaller.
Roland Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 10:45 pm
Clem’s blog tells us that we should really be buying off-the-shelf Omneos instead of fucking around with LTK-“designed” FRA-compliant CalFICKISSenTrains with 1/2 a toilet, 10,000 straps and no bikes: http://caltrain-hsr.blogspot.com/2016/07/the-capacity-problem.html.
Now that we have that settled, all we need to do is to figure out how many motorized bogies an Omneo needs to leave a KISS sucking Omneo dirt.
Joey Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 12:45 am
Really? Because Clem doesn’t seem to think his blog tells us that.
Roland Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 1:59 am
The Bombardier OMNEO product page gives 4.8 seats/m in 2+2 configuration and 5.7 seats/m in 2+3. That is indeed very dense, although tricks can be played with seat pitch in these “brochure” figures, not unlike for commercial airliners.
Your six-car bilevel example above comes out to 4.4 seats/m including the locomotive.
The six-car Stadler KISS used on the Zurich S-Bahn (2+2) comes out to 3.6 seats/m. Those don’t have large empty areas for bikes as Caltrain will.
With dual-level boarding and expansive bike storage spaces (two entire lower levels), you lose ~150 seats and end up around 2.6 seats/m, which really sucks for a bilevel commuter train. 3+2 seating (which Caltrain should really really consider at this point) lifts that back to about 3.3 seats/m.
Sheer seating capacity didn’t figure strongly into the EMU RFP.
Joe Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 7:08 am
@joey help me out with a quote or link.
@roland stuck behind the curve complaining about decisions already made.
Roland Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 12:21 pm
The above quote is from Clem (not me) http://caltrain-hsr.blogspot.com/2016/07/the-capacity-problem.html?showComment=1468476248942#c8169380788098012134
Joe Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 12:48 pm
Yes it is from Clem.
He’s replying to a question on his blog.
You’re telling us we should have bought a different EMU. Even when level boarding is negatively impacted. Sad.
Roland Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 10:49 pm
Would you care to elaborate on “even when level boarding is impacted”?
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-H4YGIXsWZmM/VKE3KJoZKeI/AAAAAAAACzU/BoT688udIuo/s1600/Regio_Lille_084.jpg
Paul Dyson Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 5:57 pm
In my mind I am contrasting Burbank junction at 40mph with Aynho at 75 or better. And of course that is the secondary route between London and Birmingham
Paul Dyson Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 6:15 pm
Correction, 90mph
Roland Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 7:21 pm
Painful, ain’t it?
Clem Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 6:59 pm
Acceleration is what increases average train speeds. Increased average train speeds are needed to blend effectively with HSR on two tracks, without unduly reducing the number of trains per hour that can fit on the peninsula corridor. This is the right way to do it, and Caltrain’s RFP placed a premium on acceleration performance over sheer seating capacity. Fast trains improve corridor capacity. Even the Brits get it.
The Stadler KISS (developed for the Zurich S-Bahn) is exactly what Caltrain needed.
Roland Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 7:14 pm
Kindly help me understand which part of
“Respondents were asked about potential amenities on the new electric trains and asked to rate them on a 5-point scale where 5 is very important and 1 is not at all important, as well as rank them in terms of priority. By far the most important amenity for the new electric trains is seating, rated highest among all options at 4.43.”By far the most important amenity for the new electric trains is seating, rated highest among all options at 4.43”
it is that you do not understand.
http://www.caltrain.com/Assets/_MarketDevelopment/pdf/Caltrain+Customer+Experience+Survey+2016.pdf (page 7)
Joe Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 7:33 pm
“Amenities” okay let’s look at seating amenities.
More trains per hour mean more seats. Still too focused on the car and not total system seating for peak service period.
BART also has fewer seats per car but the new cars provide more seating due to more cars for trains and in service. It’s explained in their FAQ.
Clem Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 7:36 pm
Go ask for 3+2 seating at the next board meeting. Or are middle seats worse than standing?
Roland Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 7:54 pm
Why should I go around asking anyone for 3+2 seating when I know that it is useless (500mm vs. 650 mm seats)?
Clem Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 8:00 pm
Whatever you advocate, make sure that it’s about future decisions, not past.
Roland Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 10:55 am
So, If I understand you correctly, you are advocating that the 2,956 Caltrain riders who completed this survey should consider alternate modes of transportation?
http://www.caltrain.com/Assets/_MarketDevelopment/pdf/Caltrain+Customer+Experience+Survey+2016.pdf
How about a bike lane between SF & SJ with electric bike sharing? Would that work or do you have something else in mind?
Clem Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 11:20 am
More cars (all 8-car trains in 2020), 3+2 seating, and expedite level boarding. Turn Baby Bullet diesel sets into loco+8 Bombardier+loco formations pending 100% EMU fleet.
Roland Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 11:37 am
Progress (of sorts)!!!
Point of clarification: are we talking about a KISS or an Omneo EMU fleet?
Clem Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 11:54 am
KISS. The Omneo, besides not being bid in the first place, did not have a good path to level boarding.
EJ Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 2:18 pm
@Clem you’re just not throwing a big enough tantrum. If you just yell and scream and call everyone else stupid, anything is possible!
Roland Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 11:25 pm
How about some light reading and trying to make this work with a CalFranKISSentrain?
http://www.caltrain.com/Assets/Caltrain+Modernization+Program/Blended+System/Caltrain-HSR+Blended+Service+Plan+Ops-Con-Report.pdf (table 18 on page 36).
Oh, and BTW, don’t forget the Board-mandated 8-1 seat to bike ratio and let’s see how many bikes and seats you end up with(?)
Wells Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 9:05 am
3+2 seating is the better choice in terms of comfort, ease of passage, privacy, premium seating,
oh nevermind, you guys think I’m stupid, therefore I’m stupid. Ya know where you can ride
a comfortable train ride? Neither Toots nor Tootsie respect any viewpoint from those
who’ve never been on board their Cascades. My count is over 40-some trips along the Sound.
A wonderful waterside ride to maintain excursion train rides daydreaming in Talgo.
Roland Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 10:51 pm
Right: http://www.newsbombardierfrance.com/2014/12/42-regio-2n-pour-lile-de-france.html
Wells Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 9:14 am
3+2 seating is the better choice in terms of comfort, ease of passage, privacy, premium seating,
and many other off hand reasons besides thoughtlessly simple high capacity. Uhhhh….
Thanks for the take on approval. I heard Atherton trees are fast-growing weed shrub. The Irony?
http://m.gilroydispatch.com/news/what-s-faster-to-san-jose-train-car-or-bus/article_07ebc8d2-4a08-11e6-bef8-6fb0724db6d4.html?mode=jqm
Reedman Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 9:09 am
Run the same experiment, but from Diridon to Gilroy at 7am. The (missing) train will lose …
Joe Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 9:24 am
When HSR starts, the AM San Jose train will beat any car to Gilroy.
Roland Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 2:54 pm
The other 11 trains will get to San Jose even faster: https://youtu.be/NUdGg3GiAbg. This is not a problem because Ben Tripousis guarantees that residents won’t be able to hear each train for more than 4 seconds.
Joe Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 3:09 pm
Possibly. More likely they’ll run trains that make all stops in phase one.
William Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 3:20 pm
In the video, most of the noise is the big blower from the power cars that are above the short sound wall. In the same situation, CHSR EMUs will have their power components under floor thus deflected away. The other noticeable source of noise is the buffing sound caused by the spacing between the cars, which newer HSR trainsets have space fillers to mitigate this type of noise. Also, the sound wall could be higher in my opinion.
In other words, CHSR or any other newer HSR lines will not be as noisy as the example given.
Roland Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 5:08 pm
Here is what an E320 sounds like in the same spot:
https://youtu.be/os1b9p0jagQ
https://youtu.be/k5vkLoq7DLA?t=20
William Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 5:23 pm
much quieter, isn’t it?
Joe Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 6:32 pm
Design sounds walls for 220 mph which means 16ft plus tall.
At speeds over 150 MPH train noise will come from wheels but the dominate noise is aerodynamic forces at the top of the train for higher speeds. These are also sound waves at a different wavelength and attenuate different, less easily.
YouTube vids ain’t going to capture the noise.
Roland Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 8:20 pm
Really?
https://youtu.be/aKG2yW-RRZE
https://youtu.be/He5VbCcrfjc
Jerry Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 8:44 pm
The cows didn’t seem to notice.
Roland Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 8:49 pm
The cows lose all hearing shortly after birth.
EJ Reply:
July 21st, 2016 at 6:49 am
Really.
Roland Reply:
July 21st, 2016 at 2:10 pm
I guess it depends on whether your amp has valves (Joe’s does).
Joe Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 8:44 pm
Really.
Unless you have an “11” on your amp.
Clem Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 8:02 pm
What is there in Gilroy that warrants going there at 7AM?
Roland Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 8:43 pm
Nothing. Every single living soul (including the entire City Council) hits 101 by 6.00 AM but there are unconfirmed rumors that a couple of natives occasionally get lost on Caltrain hence the urgent need to replace the Gilroy trains with 6-car Bombardiers: http://www.smdailyjournal.com/articles/lnews/2016-07-15/caltrain-replacing-gallery-cars-with-bombardiers/1776425165069.html.
Too bad there won’t be any seats left in the CalFICKISSenTrain by the time the Gilroy train pulls up at Tamien:-)
Joe Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 10:34 pm
Blossom Hill Boyz rulz.
Full build will see a Gilroy staged AM train heading north to San Jose and on to Mid Pennisula, SFO and SF.
Roland Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 10:53 pm
Let’s see: there are currently 350K people with an average household income > $95K within 5 miles of Blossom Hill. Would you like to share the equivalent numbers for Gilroy?
Joe Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 7:17 am
Blossom Hill Boyz rulz.
Share the boardings for Blossom Hill.
Your awsome stop like all south county stops is under served. Maybe stop ahowing off with retrospective criticism and start advocating for more service. stay on message.
Roland Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 8:26 am
Tamien-like service@Blossom Hill will happen as soon as the CRRA figure out that the only way to get rid of the CalFICKISSenTrains parked on MT-2 @Tamien is to extend Tamien-like service to Blossom Hill. When that happens, Gilroy passengers will have to transfer to a Blossom Hill-staged AM train heading north to San Jose and on to Mid Pennisula, SFO and SF.
Blossom Hill Boyz rulz.
joe Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 9:00 am
Maybe. Not sure to what CRRA refers.
Hard to tell if Caltrain’s electrified system will be extended past Tamien to Blossom Hill. No HSR money for that extension and VTA knows BART to SJ Diridon for HSR transfers is more important to the state.
Maybe if there was a champion …. and of course grandstanding that Caltrain is stupid and all their decisions are horrible and San Mateo is corrupt isn’t going to win public support for these expensive extensions.
BTW Gilroy to SF and SFO would be best on HSR.
Roland Reply:
July 21st, 2016 at 2:22 am
There is no HSR money south of San Jose (no possibility for Prop1A compliance) and the VTA (not “Caltrain”) is 100% responsible for rail south of Tamien.
Joe Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 8:43 pm
Monterey Co. and Holister/San Benito.
HSR is not a commuter system so the station catchment isn’t a 5km radius. San Benito bus and MST 55 stops at Gilroy and proceeds to SJ for Amtrak.
Phase 1 HSR is limited and links to a Bakersfield area station and Transfer platform south of Merced. Time penalty to stop vs potential ridership means I assume they’ll stop
allow people to exit at Gilroy.
OT: SEPTA/LTK update:
Does anyone have any idea how “One of the reasons it has taken this long to inspect all of the affected trucks is because it takes 20 hours to remove a truck from under a car for inspection and testing.” could possibly be true? http://www.phillymag.com/news/2016/07/14/septa-silverliner-v-inspections-2/
Richard Mlynarik Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 3:05 pm
Shade tree mechanics.
If you think that the conductors and ding-ding-ding bells and Highball on the Green and COT&S and multi-hour headways of Olde Tyme American Railroading are antediluvian, you’re not seen anything until you scratch their maintenance “practices”. 25% fleet spares ratios and hugely bloated negative productivity payrolls don’t come cheaply, and certainly not in a timely manner.
Note that the catastrophically shit-filled hyper-prescriptive LTK-written Caltrain EMU RFP requires CEMOF. Along with diesel locomotive maintenance, delivery of scale model trains, no semi-permanent car coupling, and pretty much every random kind of crap you could imagine in your worst nightmares. (Nothing useful about interior sound levels or the like, of course. Fuck passengers.) It’s a miracle they got a single bid, and it’s pretty much a certainty the sole bidder will regret it.
Aarond Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 3:24 pm
Don’t forget that SEPTA is a public agency. Private companies run everything until they physically break. Or they’d just weld on more support and demand heavier bogies so that the problem solves itself. The FRA would then use this data to “prove” how vital their compression tests are. 50 years later everyone wonders why American railcars are built like tanks.
Aarond Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 3:09 pm
For inspection *and* testing? Sure. One 6-hour shift is spent actually disassembling the vehicle, another six being used to setup, inspect, and re-inspect the bogies. Add another six for a second inspector/set of equipment. Then another six to reassemble the vehicle. And all this has to be done without any workplace accidents.
Ever swap a car engine? Assuming everything goes right, it’s easily 180 minutes to drain everything, disconnect everything, and actually lift the engine out.
Roland Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 4:40 pm
Here is how to swap (not just “remove”) a bogie in two hours: http://www.mechan.co.uk/rail/bogie-wheelset-drops/. Wouldn’t swapping bogies with tested ones and taking the old ones away for inspection be more effective?
Peter Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 5:05 pm
Sure, if you have a fleet-sized set of spare bogies available (Wasn’t Richard just bitching above about keeping too many spares on-site? Or was he bitching about too few spares? Can’t tell sometimes once Richard’s red mist descends).
Weren’t the vast majority of bogies affected by these failures? Wouldn’t they run out of spares really quickly, without having determined the root cause of the failures?
Roland Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 5:50 pm
“SEPTA does have some spare wheel assemblies on hand, and Kneuppel said that cars with equalizer bars that do not yet show signs of fatigue can have trucks replaced with the spares. “About 30 to 40 trucks have no cracks,””
http://www.phillymag.com/news/2016/07/03/septa-alternate-service-plan-regional-rail/
Any idea why they can’t just turn trucks around and back in line for re-swapping as soon as they are done inspecting them?
Peter Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 9:11 pm
From one of the photos: “The absence of red streaks indicates no stress fractures. However, SEPTA will not attempt to return undamaged trucks to service until the failure analysis is complete.”
They don’t know why they failed and are not going to put them back in service until they figure it out.
Aarond Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 5:16 pm
These blow holes into my comment as well:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ALXXpPPGm0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_yrwrFmLk24
Which leads me to believe that the journalist either got the wording of the “20 hours” comment wrong, otherwise I’d really like to know why it takes 20 hours even if it’s just OSHA compliance.
swing hanger Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 12:23 am
Swapping out bogies on a railcar is a pretty simple matter done within 30 minutes, this is a record of such an operation, though the replacement bogies are temporary bogies used only within the depot:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cE0B2qUgYuk
fwiw, bogie assembly can be done quite quickly (in a quarter hour if this is an unedited segment), beginning with the wheelsets ready to accept the primary suspension springs, and finally with dropping in the traction motors:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r7K6C9Z8Ro0
U.S. Surface Transportation Board declines jurisdiction over Texas bullet train
Almost identical to the failed effort of Caltrain to get excused from CEQA
Eric M Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 4:32 pm
Apparently you forgot, The U.S. Surface Transportation Board rules that federal law overrides lawsuits using the California Environmental Quality Act to delay or halt the Fresno-Bakersfield high-speed rail route. (PDF)
Zorro Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 5:12 pm
TC was ruled against, cause TC does not go interstate, not even to tickets with Amtrak.
Federal board declines to oversee Houston-Dallas bullet train project
Joe Reply:
July 19th, 2016 at 7:40 pm
They ruled Commuter rail systems are not exempt.
The STB Federalized the CHAR project. Bakersfield stopped thier EIR lawsuit because CEQA would not apply. They settled ASAP.
Texas opposition to private rail and now Atherton’s EIR belligerence will force CHAR to abandon voluntary CEQA compliance when they start building out the ROW.
And adding more fuel to the Hyperloop One dumpster fire: http://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-tn-hyperloop-lawsuit-20160719-snap-story.html
6 Months of Progress on High Speed Rail
A new video showing more of the progress being made in California High Speed rail.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_D1EKDbFW2I
SMCo. Hwy 101 HOV/HOT lane funds sought: MTC seeks federal dollars to ease congestion
MTC shifts $8.9m to planning, engineering & environmental studies for SMCo. Hwy 101 HOV express lanes
Aarond Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 1:21 pm
We’re in this place is because SF doesn’t care about increasing Caltrain connectivity. In many cases (and there’s a lot of them), a charter bus will get people from the Peninsula to SF quicker compared to a Caltrain/BART/Muni transfer. The situation will not change even after electrification, HSR, the DTX and central subway are completed.
The only way to fix this is to do a 19th/Geary BART subway, because that’s where people want to get to and from.
Aarond Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 1:32 pm
To be clear: a 19th/Geary subway would give people a reason to transfer to BART at Milbrae, rather than take a charter bus. Also, in this way they can ignore Muni entirely (which is apparently SFMTA’s goal).
Joey Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 2:05 pm
A timed transfer with fare integration might give people a reason to transfer at Millbrae…
Joe Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 3:05 pm
That will help but it is a circuitous trip.
We’ll drive to Daly City and park as opposed to Millbrae. Also there is more service at Daly.
Swinging so far west, BART would benefit from a transfer onto a transit system providing easy access to western SF. Geary Subway maybe. Something running north/south to and along the 19th Ave corridor.
adirondacker12800 Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 3:23 pm
A three seat ride that is longer does mean that, insert a long plaintive sigh here, that people will be able to spend more time on BART. Instead of a faster two seat ride on Caltrain.
joe Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 3:57 pm
That’s interesting.
I try not to comment on NYC transit – limited experience.
You just told me Caltrain is faster but It’s not for the west and south parts of SF given my experiences. maybe you can show me the way with google maps.
My old neighborhood Noe Valley, people near BART now take BART 24th or Glenn park BART to Milbrae and transfer. That wasn’t there in my tenure so I can’t say but I think its faster than a reverse trip into SF and then south.
Aarond Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 3:56 pm
Perhaps, but the problem of connectivity is still there. There’s three ways to solve it:
– BART up 19th/Geary removes Muni from the equation, and thus weighs the argument in Caltrain’s favor since people can actually get to it.
– Muni could run LRT down Geneva into a proper Bayshore station, as well as connect Muni LRT itself into the new TTC. Also 19th/Geary LRT. This removes BART from the equation.
– Caltrain up 380, then underground under 19th/Geary to terminate in the new TTC.
– (ideal solution) standard gauge BART which would allow them to expand into the Caltrain corridor
The whole point is to connect the places people live, to the places they work. Right now 3-4 transfers across different systems is way too much of a hassle compared to running a company bus down 280.
Aarond Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:24 pm
To clarify: SF has only one transit network that goes south (Caltrain), which has poor connectivity with the citywide metro network. This is the issue that needs to be addressed. There is a disconnect between Muni/BART and Caltrain/VTA.
Example: company buses hit up Dolores and 18th, adjacent to J-Church. Why don’t people take Muni instead? Because it has no southern outlet to Caltrain. Introducing a better Muni transfer at Bayshore via with Geneva LRT makes the buses here redundant.
Similarly, buses that head up to the Panhandle and Marina do so because there’s no trains up there. Running BART along Geary, and then south on 19th, fixes this issue (for most people) as it gives them a means to actually access Caltrain.
The third option is to just run Caltrain under 380, 19th and Geary into the new TTC. Or re-gauging BART, which would give people a reason to transfer into it.
joe Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 5:23 pm
Dolores and 18th is near 16th st BART at Mission – that’s a trip south to Milbrae transfer.
Between 24th BART and Glenn Park BART is a missing 30th St station. There isn’t a good way to Caltrain but easy car trip – Dolores to San Jose Ave to 280 to 380. I used that to get to Stanford in the 90’s via car.
Possibly add 30th BART and Improve connectivity at Bayshore/Paul Ave stops for T-Muni transfer in South SF and to MUNI 24 trolly carrying people west into Bernal Heights/ Upper Mission/Upper Noe Valley/ Castro.
Ted K. Reply:
July 21st, 2016 at 12:44 am
@joe – Your dream of a 30th Street BART station near Mission is actually a nightmare.
A) BART doesn’t want it due to scheduling issues (Glen Park and 24th Street aren’t all that far apart);
B) The tunnel slopes too much in that area for a simple infill project – the tunnel would need a major rebuild before a station could be built; and
C) Construction staging requirements would ignite a firestorm of opposition. Plus the price tag would be as bad as, if not worse than, the Central Subway.
I used to live on 21st Street (70s – 90s) and shopped at the Safeway near 30th. Your dream looks great on a map but there’s no barn for the horse to return to. It burned to the ground when BART raped Mission Street and the neighbors stole the foundation stones for their own buildings.
(Apologies for the extended metaphor.)
@Aarond – s/LRT/BRT/
An SFMuni BRT serving the Bayshore Station makes sense. It’s cost effective, mostly timely, and comes with a Plan B (an ‘R’ service that tests the waters). Light rail service is pretty in concept but would get very ugly during the planning process.
And guys, WHERE’S THE MONEY ?
Roland Reply:
July 21st, 2016 at 1:46 am
Here is some of the money for the Geneva-Harney BRT & T-third station @ Bayshore (the BRT goes all the way to Balboa Park): http://www.cahsrblog.com/2016/07/six-months-of-hsr-progress/#comment-286770
T
Neil Shea Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:30 pm
Convert BART to eBART from Millbrae to Daly City, and continue it up 19th Ave. then East on Geary to TTC – or into the North Beach T-Third Portal. That way it’s affordable and it will work when it’s done ( unlike Bart which is falling apart). Will also support one seat rides to Silicon Valley jobs as needed.
Service to SFO airport provided via HSR, Caltrain, this new eBART or Dumbarton rail. For riders on Legacy BART (or Muni), one transfer at TTC (via underground moving sidewalk) or Daly City or Union City.
With Bart this hasn’t been possible for 50 years and isn’t realistically possible in the future. It’s not even discussed except by transit wonks on here. With eBART this is realistic now.
Neil Shea Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 4:55 pm
Gotta convert an existing lane. That could be done in a year at minimal cost. Adding a lane would be a 10-year $1B project involving many property takes, painful overpass replacements, and years of looking for funds that may never materialize. Convert the lane now and promise the new lane down the road based on funding (including a contribution from the tolls).
And of course — fix caltrain as Aaron and everyone says. Dont leave any cars parked unused, buy more used cars now until electrification completed
joe Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 5:13 pm
Doesn’t CA forbid converting existing lanes ? HOV have to be new lanes as I recall.
Maybe possible to squeeze a lane in from Redwood city to SF boundary as they did with HW85 adding an HOV lane to two lane HW 85 between 101 and 280 (removing shoulder) and minimal expansion on 101 between 85 and University Ave.
Finally, HOV can be tolled so this is probably an HOV lane with a future toll for use by single car drivers. That means it’s a revenue lane. We’ll see this HOV Toll installed HW 101 Morgan Hill north with $$$ going to BART expansion in Santa Clara Co.
Reedman Reply:
July 20th, 2016 at 5:31 pm
Thank the 1976 HOV lane experiment on the Santa Monica Freeway (I-10). Converting an existing mixed-use lane to HOV resulted in an increase in congestion and an almost-empty HOV lane. The public response was quick and heated, causing Caltrans to reverse the conversion.
Neil Shea Reply:
July 21st, 2016 at 10:16 am
I’m not sure if you need to change a law or not. My point remains we have two options:
1) change an existing lane in one year for a cost in the range of $100 million OR
2) build a new lane taking 10 years for a cost north of $1 billion
(if the lane does not go the full length of the county then huge backups will be created wherever it ends)
I don’t hear anyone disagreeing with these basic assumptions
Joe Reply:
July 21st, 2016 at 10:29 am
Maybe not 10B
Adding a lane here with complex interchange …
http://www.dot.ca.gov/dist4/scl101auxlanes/
…Wasn’t 100M
Neil Shea Reply:
July 21st, 2016 at 12:46 pm
Joe — I wrote $1B+ not 10B. And was that the link you intended to share? There’s no Interachange in there. And you know better than to compare to an Auxiliary Lane project.
The entire raison d’etre of Auxiliary Lanes is that you do not replace overpasses, which can easily cost more for each one than that entire project you reference. If replacing an interchange costs $150m each, and there are only 15 of them, that’s a cool $2.25B.
To ADD a lane to 101 in San Mateo County will require — besides extensive property takes all along the corridor — replacing many very old overpasses with no room for another lane underneath. Each one can take up to 2 years do to — after planning, engineering and finding funds.
You can’t do them all at once. And its almost counterproductive to open short stretches of new lane as you do them because the resulting merge can cancel much of the benefit (unless maybe you start at RWC and work North).
We need a continuous Managed Lane from SC to SF County lines. Otherwise you will dump a big mess on some community. Obviously Caltrans would gladly take on $Billions of additional work over the next decade…
Joe Reply:
July 21st, 2016 at 1:03 pm
I wasnt clear but thought you knew the area and project.
The segment with added lanes includes adding lanes at the 85 101 interchange. Very constricted area and costly construction. It’s representative.
The expansion of lanes with an added lane for merging. HW 85 was expanded from 2 to 3 with no overpass re work. 101 also added HOV for two total and Aux lane with no overpass reworking. (Maybe some on Middlefield exit)
I used to commute 101 from University and exit SF Vermont Ave. I don’t have full recall of the HW and if significant property will be taken. That’s the point of the study.
HOV should be added and it’s not a boondoggle. The lane will probably be HOV express and tolled. It will produce revenue.
Joe Reply:
July 21st, 2016 at 1:06 pm
Also
Santa Clara will have 101 express lanes from the 101 border at San Mateo County to Morgan Hill @ East Dunne exit.
This 101 extension in San Mateo Co to SF fixes the HOV gap at Redwood City northward. We really need to build express / HOV to SFO.
Roland Reply:
July 22nd, 2016 at 4:07 am
Brilliant! Right now, Google is telling us to get off @ Bailey to avoid the bottleneck at the end of the HOV lane after 4.00 PM, take Monterey Highway and get back on 101 @ Cochrane. I just can’t wait for the HOV lane extension to East Dunne! Who knows: we may be able to get back on 101 @ Tennant. Morgan Hill will be absolutely thrilled with the downtown traffic!
Neil Shea Reply:
July 21st, 2016 at 3:36 pm
Not sure when I’m driving it next, but worth counting them. Because the overpasses are old I was assuming it is not a simple matter of removing shoulders.
Definitely agree that SM Cty needs a ‘Managed Lane’ (HOT/Express) from SC to SF Counties. They’ll probably need two of them. Plus 3 lanes for General Flow traffic. I know converting a lane is not popular, even if FB, Google and Jim Wunderman tell you to do it.
Joe Reply:
July 21st, 2016 at 4:17 pm
Some old overpasses make need to be modernized and repaired anyway.
101 Tully and Capitol overpass and cloverleafs were redesigned / repaired and it improved traffic flow immensely on 101 and side streets.
There are regs at the federal and state level for converting to HOV involving local approval. Not sure SM Co would approve of a conversion.
Meanwhile Atherton litigates.
Roland Reply:
July 21st, 2016 at 3:00 am
Here is a letter from Facebook explaining why they support this (they have had it with “Caltrain”): http://mtc.legistar.com/gateway.aspx?M=F&ID=9292b3fc-d42f-403b-af32-11cfec767005.pdf (page 3).
Employers will demand “transit-only” lanes on 101 the day they find out about the CalFranKISSenTrain: http://sf.streetsblog.org/2016/07/12/vta-sales-tax-promises-transit-lanes-on-highway-85/.
Joe Reply:
July 21st, 2016 at 1:15 pm
Facebook has not hadn’t with Caltrain.
1) A backlash against buses on small streets in SF have reduced tech bus quality of service and moved Facebook employees to autos.
http://www.sfchronicle.com/business/article/More-tech-workers-driving-solo-after-SF-cuts-8350171.php
2) Backlash with buses at PAMPA also forces employees to drive.
http://www.paloaltoonline.com/news/2010/07/19/neighbors-dont-like-facebook-shuttles
Facebook suports multimodal transit including cars. They’ll support a HW expansion. That’s why they built the campus near 101.
Roland Reply:
July 22nd, 2016 at 4:50 am
That’s why Facebook built their campus near Dumbarton Rail (the Menlo Park station is in the middle of the campus) but they eventually gave up on SamTrans ever taking Caltrain up there (no hybrids), so they switched to Plan B (get hybrids from the private sector): https://youtu.be/3TNFWZrzUw4?t=5462.