LA Times Reporter Tries to Scare Californians Out of Building Better Future

Sep 7th, 2011 | Posted by

I’m sure you’ve all seen the latest economic numbers. Zero jobs were created in August. Europe is in full-fledged crisis. The New York Times reports we are on the verge of a double-dip recession. To the extent we ever did exit the 2007-09 recession, it was solely due to the stimulus package that President Barack Obama pushed through Congress in February 2009. That stimulus was too small, but it also included $8 billion for high speed rail – and that money is what has brought California close to starting construction on its high speed rail project.

As the global economy teeters on the brink, many leading economic observers are screaming for more stimulus, recognizing that the only way to avoid another crash and a prolonged Depression is to generate new demand by creating jobs and sparking spending. Bill Gross, founder of Newport Beach’s Pacific Investment Management Company (PIMCO) and one of the most influential investors on the planet, called for massive new infrastructure stimulus, between $3 and $4 trillion in size, to avoid a double-dip:

In the near term, then, we should not rely solely on job or corporate-directed payroll tax credits because corporations may not take enough of that bait, and they’re sitting pretty as it is. Government must step up to the plate, as it should have in early 2009. An infrastructure bank to fund badly needed reconstruction projects is a commonly accepted idea, despite the limitations of the original “shovel-ready” stimulus program in 2009.

Nouriel Roubini, who was one of the most prescient voices predicting the 2008 crash and recession, has similarly been screaming about the need for more stimulus:

“You need to restore economic growth, not five years from now, you need to restore it today,” Roubini said. “In the short term, we need to do massive stimulus, otherwise there’s going to be another Great Depression. Things are getting worse and the big difference between now and a few years ago is that this time around we’re running out of policy bullets.”

It’s obvious to everybody who actually understands how the global economy works that we are facing a serious crisis, leading to greater unemployment and suffering, unless we produce more stimulus, focused on infrastructure. High speed rail is exactly the kind of stimulus that we need – it will put a lot of people to work, save money over the long-term, and support new growth for decades to come.

Or we can sit on our ass and do nothing. That is the path advocated by LA Times reporter Ralph Vartabedian in an article full of fear, uncertainty and doubt about high speed rail costs. The article isn’t even very well-informed as to the details of the HSR project, but its primary purpose is to say “omg this might cost a lot of money so we shouldn’t do it!”

It’s the kind of argument made by someone who either has no clue about the economic crisis we face or who simply doesn’t care.

State voters have agreed to issue more than $9 billion in bonds to build the system, but that’s a fraction of the $43 billion projected tab for the initial phase. And those costs could swell to $65 billion or more, by some estimates.

Should federal funds dry up after the scheduled start of construction next year, the state could be left with no more than an unfulfilled dream and some tracks in the Central Valley.

“If the federal government and private investors are not going to provide funds, and California is broke, why would it take on an enormous new commitment?” asked Martin Wachs, a Rand Corp. transportation expert and former director of UC Berkeley’s Institute of Transportation Studies.

This is nonsense. The federal government, in the form of President Obama and the Senate, have shown a strong desire to provide funds. The article quotes Kevin McCarthy, a leading House Republican who represents Bakersfield, as saying the House isn’t interested in more HSR funding:

Rep. Kevin McCarthy (R-Bakersfield), the majority whip whose district would be served by the rail line, said he doubted that any spending measure that contains funding for high-speed rail in California or anywhere else would pass the House.

“I don’t know how anybody can come to the conclusion that the California high-speed rail is a good investment in the financial times we are in,” McCarthy said. “When California has the deficit problem it has now, how can it envision finishing this?”

What Vartabedian doesn’t tell readers is that McCarthy’s party is facing a return to minority status, as polls suggest Democrats will retake the House in the 2012 election.

More importantly, Vartabedian assumes that McCarthy is right that deficits and recession mean we shouldn’t spend money on new things. That is exactly the kind of thinking that has caused the recovery to stall. “The financial times we are in” require us to spend a LOT more money to get out of it, as Gross and Roubini suggest.

It’s not a new lesson. The infrastructure projects of the 1930s helped pull the state and the country out of the depths of the Depression, sliding back only in 1937 when stimulus was withdrawn too soon. The Depression ended for good when a truly enormous government stimulus program, World War II, was launched. It doesn’t require a war to get government to launch a huge spending project. It can and ought to be done in peacetime, especially when the rewards are so obvious.

One reason we’re not seeing that coming out of Congress right now is because media outlets like the LA Times run articles designed to scare people into thinking that doing something to get out of a crisis is somehow worse than doing nothing and ensuring we stay there. Just look at the fear mongering in this article:

The upcoming decisions on the high-speed rail system represent one of the ultimate philosophical clashes in public spending. The sheer size and scope of the rail system makes it one of the most ambitious programs ever undertaken by a state known for gutsy projects….

In scope and cost, it would eclipse any of the state’s dams, office buildings, canals, highways or other government structures, including the Golden Gate Bridge.

Even if there are no cost overruns, it would be twice as expensive as the State Water Project, the 1960s-era system that transports northern Sierra water to Southern California. A study this year estimated the current cost to replace that system of dams and canals at $18 billion.

And the plan would require some ambitious engineering. Tunnels would stretch miles. Trains would soar over cities atop viaducts six stories tall. Three mountain ranges would be crossed. The zigzagging route would gobble up homes, businesses and farmland.

Vartabedian gives this litany to suggest all the things that could go wrong with the HSR project, with the intent of showing people “see? this isn’t a good idea.” But a state that was interested in building a better future rather than wallowing in the gutter would look at these challenges and say “so what? We can solve those problems.”

The article wonders what Governor Jerry Brown will do given these concerns, and quotes Brown’s advisors:

A Brown advisor, speaking on condition that he not be identified, said a “steep erosion in confidence” in the authority has led to concerns about the project. The authority had planned to issue a new business plan in October to support the upcoming bond issue, but that plan may be delayed by Brown’s review, he said.

To accelerate the network’s development, the Brown administration might seek to tie high-speed service into existing urban rail systems.

Yesterday’s news that the ridership projections have been validated by the peer review group should be a big help. Many of the CHSRA’s critics based their arguments in claims that the ridership numbers are flawed. They can no longer credibly make that claim, and that means the Business Plan will be that much stronger once it’s completed.

I don’t think that tying HSR service into “existing urban rail systems” will do anything at all to “accelerate the network’s development,” however. The key is the Central Valley, linking SF to LA. Simply upgrading existing urban rail systems will do very little to help achieve the all-important goal of linking SF to LA, rather than SF to San José or LA to Anaheim. And building in urban areas is going to be much, much more difficult than building in the Central Valley.

Still, we should keep in mind that Gov. Brown understands the need to take risks to embrace a better future:

Gov. Jerry Brown said this afternoon that California’s embattled high-speed rail project should move forward, despite growing criticism about the project’s management and cost.

While the nation is in a “period of massive retrenchment,” Brown told The Fresno Bee’s editorial board, “I would like to be part of the group that gets America to think big again.”

The Obama Administration clearly agrees, as the article closes with this quote from the USDOT:

“I can’t think of any mega-project like this that had all of the funding in place before it began,” said Roy W. Kienitz, undersecretary of the U.S. Department of Transportation. “If you have the ambition to do something big like this, you have to live with the fact that there is going to be uncertainty in the future.”

The project’s details matter. But if we approach them with a constructive and bold spirit, we can solve them. If we approach them with a destructive and timid spirit, we’ll be bogged down by the smallest and simplest problems, paralyzed into inaction.

In short, it’s not really about the details. It’s about our political will to solve them. High speed rail has life in California because enough voters and leaders realized it was part of our economic recovery strategy. Its fate will be determined on the basis of our commitment to recovery – and our commitment to our own future.

  1. joe
    Sep 7th, 2011 at 21:27
    #1

    “If the federal government and private investors are not going to provide funds, and California is broke, why would it take on an enormous new commitment?” asked Martin Wachs, a Rand Corp. transportation expert and former director of UC Berkeley’s Institute of Transportation Studies.

    First, there is a simple Keynesian explanation for why infrastructure investment during a liquidity trap is necessary.

    Second, I now understand more of the context and perspective that guided the UC Berkley Institute of Transportation Members’ review of the CS’s HSR Ridership Model.

    Review of “Bay Area/California High-Speed Rail Ridership and Revenue Forecasting Study”
    David Brownstone, Professor of Economics, UC Irvine
    Mark Hansen, Professor of Civil and Environmental Engineering, UC Berkeley
    Samer Madanat, Professor of Civil and Environmental Engineering, UC Berkeley

    http://www.cahsrblog.com/2010/07/what-does-the-berkeley-its-ridership-report-actually-say/

  2. Donk
    Sep 7th, 2011 at 22:34
    #2

    When I first read the article today in LA Times before reading the summary here, I thought it was a reasonably balanced article. These are real concerns. But maybe I am just jaded since all articles I read about HSR are all doom and gloom, and this one at least had some positive things to say.

    StevieB Reply:

    The first sentence of the article is profoundly negative warning of an unexplained crushing financial burden.

    As California prepares to commit tens of billions of dollars to an ambitious high-speed rail line from San Francisco to Southern California, Congress’ political will to provide the bulk of the funding is disappearing, leaving the possibility that the state could end up stuck with a crushing financial burden.

    If no additional money comes from congress then no additional California bonds would be sold because they require matching funds. The amount of bond money committed is not small but neither is it a crushing burden.

    VBobier Reply:

    Considering how many people are cheesed off by Repugs in Congress, Repugs need to lose 31 seats in the House in 2012 for Democrats to get the House back to being People and HSR friendly, instead of KOOK friendly…

    So money for HSR will come and so will private jobs that are publicly paid for by caring people in Congress, not Imperial AstroTurfed Troglodyte Walkers or their ilk…

    Go Green Bay Packers!!

    Paulus Magnus Reply:

    GIven how feckless the Democrats were before when they had a majority, I imagine that the GOP would need to lose a lot more than just 31 seats.

    RisenMessiah Reply:

    That might be how it appears in Orange County, but nationally the trend is the opposite.

    We are currently in the midst of a realignment between the two parties that has been going for a century. (Today’s Democrats are 1900s Republicans and Today’s GOP is the Democratic Party of 1900…)

    Both parties are becoming much more homogeneous, but the Republicans appeared until the “Tea Party” showed to up to have a big, big head start. Now, we are probably approaching a situation not unlike Germany, where there will be three parties, one liberal, one conservative, and a much smaller “Pragmatist Party”.

    Because of differences between the House and Senate, that probably means Republican control for a while on the South side of the Capitol and Democrat control on the North. But in reality, the Pragmatii are going to play kingmaker to curb the influence of the fringe.

    Harry Reid has almost perfected this in the Senate, and I’m betting the House will soon too.

    synonymouse Reply:

    France is a better example where you have a labor-dominated socialist party, a business dominated center-right party, and a right nationalist party. What the US doesn’t have is a Front National, which is where the TeaParty comes in.

    RisenMessiah Reply:

    No, for a couple of reasons. Germany is federal, having more power sharing between states than France (as Alon knows). Also, unlike France, there is a Catholic-Protestant divide in Germany that is still tangible.

    The Tea Party is really the Republican base fed up with corporatism-ladden Bush years. There’s only a small segment left in the GOP that would be recognizable to Eisenhower, Ford, or Bush Sr. It’s these guys and the 20 most competitive seats in the Senate that hold all the power for the foreseeable future….

    synonymouse Reply:

    I think Pat Buchanan was a fore-runner of the Tea Party. No problem with euro-centrism or our Roman Imperial heritage.

    There is just a little taste of L’Action Francaise in the TeaParty not just Le Front National.

    Protestantism seems to have lost its mojo. From my heathen pov Protestantism is essentially Catholicism Lite.

    RisenMessiah Reply:

    Pat Buchanan, an Eastern Catholic Republican, is exactly the type of hybrid that forestalled the Tea Party’s rise.

    synonymouse Reply:

    rural & small town & urban blue collar conservatives = enough for a 3rd party

    Alon Levy Reply:

    The Tea Party is really the same as the FN, Switzerland’s SVP, Holland’s PVV, and Germany’s NDP. The precise circumstances that led to its formation are different – for one, it’s less overtly nativist than its European counterparts – but the ideology is the same, and so is the preference for grandstanding over governing.

    VBobier Reply:

    I hope Fascism isn’t coming back to Europe, not after 66 years of the Pax Americana…

    Peter Reply:

    Unfortunately for us, the Tea Party is (currently) a powerful part of a major political party, so they have much more influence than the NDP. I’m not sure about the other European parties, though.

    Peter Reply:

    @ VBobier

    I don’t think fascism is making much of a comeback. In Germany, for example, the NDP has had no national successes (it has never gotten a single seat in the Bundestag), and it has only had very limited success at the state level (it only has seats in two state parliaments). Like above, don’t quote me on the other European countries.

    Alon Levy Reply:

    Of the parties mentioned in my comment, the NDP is the weakest. I suspect it’s partly because a huge fraction of the disaffected working and lower middle class lives in the East and votes for Die Linke instead, substituting Ostalgie for romanticizing small-town life before immigration. In contrast, the FN is a serious contender for winning the friggin’ presidential election, the PVV is unofficially part of the governing coalition, and the SVP is the largest single party in the lower house.

    Risenmessiah Reply:

    Alon, the Tea Party base is the CDU.

    Peter Reply:

    No, they’re closer to the CSU. Bavaria and Texas have a LOT in common.

    Alon Levy Reply:

    Texas is a lot less racist, though. Hispanics are plugged into the GOP establishment there, and, in a move he’ll probably be running away from and apologizing for in the primary, Rick Perry refused to consider an Arizona-style anti-immigrant law.

    Also, if Texas is like Bavaria, what is its Munich?

    Mark Reply:

    Unfortunately though, the Democrats have to defend 23 seats in the senate while the Republicans are only defending 10. A number of the seats currently held by the Dems that are up for grabs are in parts of the country that could easily swing back to repubs and are currently trending that way. If the Dems win back the House, it is quite possible they lose the Senate and we are back at square one.

    adirondacker12800 Reply:

    Depends on who they nominate for President. I can see the candidate for Senate, in the interest of party unity, agreeing with the Presidential candidate that Medicare should be abolished. Along with Social Security. Truly a winning strategy. … and the thing is, Republican primary voters think it is.

    VBobier Reply:

    Seniors, Blind and Disabled people will cross party lines to keep Repugs from doing that and the people asking for Jobs will remember being ignored and I believe If the Repugs don’t pass the Presidents bill, He and every Democrat should keep reminding the voters of It, but not everyday of course, let reality work Its way in. Here in CA Feinstein will be reelected, that I have no doubt of, Repugs have a about 17 Congressional seats in CA, Hopefully CA Democrats can make that shrink to match the Repugs head size as close to zero as possible…

    RisenMessiah Reply:

    Dems are going focus on keeping the Senate. I think they only need to win one Senate seat in a state not carried by John Kerry in 2004 to hold the majority. The House, because of redistricting, might fluctuate.

    VBobier Reply:

    No Democrats need to do more than hold the US Senate, they need to retake the US House of Representatives and clean It out of the Troglodytes, send Michelle Bachmann back to the loony bin that She escaped from, etc.

    RisenMessiah Reply:

    Donk, I got much the same feeling. This is probably a 23 year old new writer who wanted a balanced piece, but was thrown this story and got a short deadline. He (or maybe she) clearly doesn’t know that much about the topic other than the typical sort of “it’s a big complicated project and in California everything seems to be big and complicated”.

    If anything, this just shows you the gap between Northern and Southern California. The Chronicle has dedicated beat writers on these topics that aren’t perfect, but can hold their own. The Times. meanwhile, still manages to have good writers and standards after nearly being blown apart by Sam Zell but must be a mess internally. And, unlike the Registrar or Union-Tribune still has resources to cover stories that aren’t “Dog Bites Man in Gumby Suit”.

    Hearst should seize this opportunity and let the Chronicle go statewide!!!! Make it happen Phil!!! (Ok, end of rant…I’ll go back into my corner now…)

    VBobier Reply:

    Hey there was a guy in a Gumby suit who tried to rob a liquor store, He left $0.27 and didn’t get anything, not even a Doughnut(Doh!), but a few laughs and the person didn’t even have the suit fully zipped up in the rear.

    Risenmessiah Reply:

    Yeah I was being tongue in cheek… :)

  3. D. P. Lubic
    Sep 8th, 2011 at 04:36
    #3

    The whole business of waiting for business to provide jobs is a bunch of hooey at this time. Where is the recovery supposed to come from?

    At the peak of the housing boom, we were building something like 2 million houses per year. Normal demand was about 700,000 per year. That means in two years we built as many houses as we would normally sell in six. Who’s going to buy those surplus houses?

    As of a couple of years ago, we had something like 117 vehicles for every 100 licensed drivers–a ratio approaching 5 to 4. How many cars can we use? How many can you drive? Not only that, but between the cost, the environmental awareness, and the sheer commonality (“Hey, man, my grandma drives, so what’s the big deal. . .”), cars just aren’t as cool with the young as they once were. How are we going to sell those? And even if we did, how many would be sold by German and Japanese firms?

    People out of work don’t have money to spend. People who still have jobs are worried about them, and are paying off their mortgages and their credit cards (good thing), but that money that is paying off the credit cards and the mortgages isn’t being used for new cars or new anything. Where is the new demand supposed to come from?

    Businesses, at least certain ones anyway, are sitting on huge mounds of cash, but they don’t see many customers coming. Why should they spend money if they don’t see more coming in?

    I would argue that we are seeing a variation of the overpopulation theme. In this case, there isn’t enough work for people to do; too much was done over the last 10 years or so (at least in certain areas). We now have not enough work and too many people.

    Now, back in the 1930s, there was a lot of scrapping of outmoded and idle factory equipment, railroad equipment, etc., because it was not needed; the Nickel Plate Road got rid of a whole lot of old stuff then, and did get some newer equipment that put it in a position to both weather the Depression and make a solid contribution in the following war era. The problem is, we aren’t talking about outmoded or unneeded iron; we’re talking about people.

    I don’t think it’s a good idea to scrap people.

    I would also say we have a lack of vision on the part of a lot of the leadership. What is unseen is that we are in an emergency that is as threatening as a war. This is the peak oil scenario, but it is playing out in slow motion (James Howard Kunstler has called it “The Long Emergency”), and a variety of prejudices, falsehoods, and old wives’s tales (“Americans love their cars,” “Government spending is bad,” “There’s plenty of oil if the enviornazis would go away.” etc.) is holding us back.

    In truth, I think we are facing a problem that is an even bigger threat than the totalitarians of the WW II era, but it is not seen, and even worse, is not something we can defeat in the normal sense. Rather, it is something we have to make an accommodation with, something we have to accept and deal with. Instead, we have been living in denial for years about this and other problems, and in all that time this has just festered and festered and now it’s terrible.

    We need to get our priorities straight, and money in such a situation is not a high priority. Can you imagine the result of WW II if we had worried about how much that effort cost? We only finished paying off the last of that debt in the last 10 years or so, but I don’t think anyone would say that effort cost too much.

    We need a similar priority shift here, and I think many are ready for it, but the leadership at all levels is too cowardly to call us for it.

    How did my country turn alternately stupid and wimpy?

  4. Peter Baldo
    Sep 8th, 2011 at 05:30
    #4

    ” Trains would soar over cities atop viaducts six stories tall.”

    I keep reading this “60 feet” number. What are they talking about? Is the 60-foot dimension ground-to-rails, or is it the height of the catenaries? Where along the route does this happen?

    Peter Reply:

    That was for Fresno before value engineering, and possibly still the case for Bakersfield. San Jose will have tall aerials (80 feet and higher in some locations) for crossing the 280/87 interchange. I think the number is to top-of-rail.

    Joey Reply:

    I’m not sure exactly where it measures to, but think about a viaduct that has to pass over existing overpasses.

  5. Peter
    Sep 8th, 2011 at 10:33
    #5

    OT: More trash from Heritage Foundation

    “Stealthy Federal Budget Plans Keep High-Speed Rail Plans alive”

    Mike Reply:

    Interesting. Heritage considers this an abomination, but it actually sounds like gleam of hope for continued federal assistance to California HSR. Anyone think that this could really happen as described in the article? Does Congress needs to annually appropriate money for RRIF? If so, the idea is doomed, but perhaps an appropriation act isn’t needed?

    VBobier Reply:

    I consider Heritage an abomination, but then It’s funded by oily KOOKs…

    I have no idea.

    Peter Reply:

    Other than DesertXpress, I don’t know of any other HSR program considering this program for financing.

    RisenMessiah Reply:

    Ha, this is pure genius on the part of the Administration. Push for an “extension” of the Transportation Act and then award $24 billion in loans. Then award CHSRA enough to complete the Initial Construction Segment.

    Donk Reply:

    Is this for real?!?

    synonymouse Reply:

    Don’t worry, Kantor is hip to what is being scammed. If the Repubs cave on this they might as well nominate Bloomberg for prez.

    If they give in to boondoggling GOP will schism faster than I predicted

    synonymouse Reply:

    Actually Cantor(I got the first letter wrong)is indicating some compromise on infrastructure. I assume he means highway spending.

    http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Politics/monitor_breakfast/2011/0908/GOP-s-Eric-Cantor-Three-ways-we-can-work-with-Obama-on-jobs

    Alon Levy Reply:

    You get the first letter wrong with Cantor, the second letter wrong with another word, and soon enough you get a word that’s nowhere on your infinite list.

    VBobier Reply:

    Syno needs a spellchecker pretty badly…

    Alon Levy Reply:

    I was not mocking Synon’s spelling. I was making a math reference.

    VBobier Reply:

    Well I think He could use one, among other things…

    Donk Reply:

    Is there anybody else here, aside from Alon, who got Alon’s math reference?

    jim Reply:

    Georgous

    Peter Reply:

    Heheh, I didn’t get it, but I thought it was pretty funny.

    neville snark Reply:

    I got it! very good.

    Risenmessiah Reply:

    Huh, what?

  6. synonymouse
    Sep 8th, 2011 at 11:16
    #6

    Blowing the treasury on “PIIG” projects like the boondoggled PB-CHSRA scheme will only guarantee even harsher austerity down the road. Even a government-run economy with Cuba-like dictatorial powers will run out of “taxpayers” and ultimately put a gun to the unions’ head. Where are the trade unions in China? Even the fabled TWU 250A will suffer a severe compensation cut because when there is no wealth left to divert to welfare.

    The evolution or devolution of the European welfare state will be like a futurecast of what is to happen here. Watch France in particular to see what transpires with their economy, jobs, social spending and ghetto crime.

    Value engineering is a pr ploy. Erecting stilts was always non-negotiable. Otherwise why would PB incite a war with otherwise sympathetic liberal PAMPA?

    VBobier Reply:

    Actually I think Cuba has no taxpayers, remember the government there owns what was formerly private property, outside of autos and personal possessions from what I’ve read.

    Besides Yer way off target.

  7. Ben
    Sep 8th, 2011 at 11:56
    #7

    The Senate Commerce Committee is having a hearing next Wednesday (9/14), ”
    Moving Intercity Passenger Rail Into the Future.” The hearing can be watched on the committee’s website and it will be web-archived.

  8. Andrew
    Sep 8th, 2011 at 13:45
    #8

    O/T, notable cover photo in the Economist this week showing 1930s SP ad.

  9. trentbridge
    Sep 8th, 2011 at 15:19
    #9

    Here’s news about House Republicans current thinking on rail:

    The House Appropriations Committee released their draft bill for 2012 spending in the transportation program, and the cuts are severe, with some key programs facing more of a reduction than others.

    Existing passenger rail service faces deep cuts of its own. Amtrak’s capital budget (new rolling stock, new lines, equipment, etc.) is cut by $24 million, but the operations budget is where Amtrak takes a big hit, going from $563 million to $227 million. On top of that, an important policy change will prevent Amtrak from using any of their operating funds on state-supported lines — lines where a state has partnered with Amtrak to increase passenger rail service and ridership. To put that change in perspective, in 2010 9 million rides were taken on state-supported routes.

    Did I mention:

    “The innovative TIGER grants, TIGGER grants and high-speed rail programs are cut entirely.”

    Take back the House!

    Nathanael Reply:

    House Republicans’ agenda consists of selling the US to a small number of fossil fuel billionaires, plus some religious fanatics. This is par for the course for these lunatics. I just wish more of America would get wise to them. Including the Senate Democrats and the President, who don’t seem to have figured out that they’re dealing with lunatics.

    VBobier Reply:

    Now Caltrains actions on moving away from Amtrak make sense, Caltrans Amtrak California may have to do the same thing.

    Spokker Reply:

    Amtrak California is mostly supported by the state. Soon the state will take over funding responsibility for the legacy Surfliner trains. The only benefit now is the Amtrak brand, which isn’t that great, and the reservation system. I say the state take over Amtrak and re-brand it and institute real integrated ticketing, not that Rail2Rail horseshit. The feds can cut long distance service for all I care.

    VBobier Reply:

    Well then If the Repugs thought they’d hurt California, then they just keep missing the Bullseye…

    D. P. Lubic Reply:

    Boy, the Repugnant Ones get stranger and stranger (I’m assuming this is Rupert Murdock’s leaning):

    http://thinkprogress.org/romm/2011/09/10/316172/ny-post-green-jobs/

    D. P. Lubic Reply:

    Somewhere I read a while back that the Republicans were actually worried that the national debt would be paid; the headline I’m looking for is that the Republicans “rescued the national debt,” or something similar. I haven’t found it yet, but I did find this:

    http://witwisdom.wordpress.com/2011/08/13/republicans-baked-americas-national-debt-pie/

    D. P. Lubic Reply:

    Still looking:

    http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/08/12/1006272/-Iowa-Debate-Confirms-GOP-Wont-Pay-Down-the-Debt

    D. P. Lubic Reply:

    Looks like the Republicans are in trouble when even Cato sees problems with them:

    http://www.cato-at-liberty.org/gop-cut-whaling-history-subsidies-save-nation/

    William Reply:

    Doesn’t Amtrak hold the exclusive right on inter-city passenger rail on host railroad who gave up passenger rail to Amtrak when Amtrak was formed?

    VBobier Reply:

    I don’t think that applies to lines in CA controlled by CalTrans.

    William Reply:

    What I thought was that on UP or BNSF owned tracks, inter-city passenger trains can only be run by Amtrak or the host railroad themselves, that’s why UP also claimed they still owned the inter-city passenger right on the Caltrain line.

    William Reply:

    I think this is also the reason why Caltrans partners with Amtrak to run Captiol Corridor, San Joaquins, and Pacific Surfliners so it doesn’t have to negotiate or buy inter-city rights from the host railroad.

    Risenmessiah Reply:

    Not to mention the fact that Amtrak has people who can operate said trains.

    William Reply:

    With the debt ceiling out of the way, I think the President has the political capital to veto any bill that doesn’t include “investment to the future”.

    Unlike a few weeks ago, the people clearly see that cutting government spending has a huge negative effect to the job market and economic growth.

    RisenMessiah Reply:

    Aside from cuts associated with the Highway Trust Fund, the draft bill doesn’t look too scary aside from the Amtrak proviso.

  10. Howard
    Sep 8th, 2011 at 17:10
    #10

    Is Obamas jobs bill going to include High Speed Rail money for California?

    VBobier Reply:

    No idea, rail was mentioned. But You know the Repugs, their oily connections hate Rail…

  11. Reality Check
    Sep 8th, 2011 at 18:14
    #11

    Sarkozy to go to Morocco for TGV Building Start

    French President Nicolas Sarkozy will visit Morocco at the end of this month to oversee the start of the construction of the TGV high-speed rail network that will connect Casablanca with Rabat and Tangiers, Sarkozy told reporters today, according to French radio station Europe 1.

    The agreement between France and Morocco on the design, construction and maintenance of the Tangier-Casablanca TGV service was signed during the visit of the French president to Morocco in October 2007, the radio station said. Alstom will supply 14 TGV trains to the Moroccan government for a total cost of 400 million euros ($556 million), Europe 1 reported.

    Reality Check Reply:

    Here’s a link to the story

  12. swing hanger
    Sep 8th, 2011 at 20:39
    #12

    Just in about an hour ago: California bullet train funding slashed by House panel
    http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2011/09/california-high-speed-rail-federal-funding-cut.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+lanowblog+%28L.A.+Now%29

    joe Reply:

    “The funding bill has to be approved by the entire Appropriations Committee and the full House. The Senate has not yet taken up rail funding.”

    Spokker Reply:

    What’s your point? A $1 billion bill got voted down in the committee. It’s going to be very difficult to get the House to agree to any kind of rail funding. They may get some shovels in the dirt in the Central Valley, but the rest of the project is in great jeopardy.

    adirondacker12800 Reply:

    Ten years ago we were all talking about what was going to happen when the Federal debt disappeared. Not the annual deficit but the total Federal debt. They were predicting 2017 if I remember correctly.
    Stuff happens, things change. The Republicans won’t hold the majority in the House forever.

  13. synonymouse
    Sep 8th, 2011 at 21:10
    #13

    California can still have upgraded passenger rail financed locally. It is possible with true value engineering along the lines laid out by Tolmach and TRAC.

    Ditch Pacheco
    Ditch neo-99 emiment domain greenfield
    Ditch the Palmdale-Tehachapi detour

    And see how much money you have saved and still have a very functional and very improved north-south passenger rail line.

  14. Travis D
    Sep 8th, 2011 at 21:23
    #14

    Looks like Obama wants to create the national infrastructure bank with his Jobs Bill. He specifically mentioned building railroads with it.

  15. D. P. Lubic
    Sep 8th, 2011 at 22:03
    #15

    Off topic, but perhaps of parallel interest–a lengthy tourist/heritage road is threatened by the snowmobile crowd that sees it as a waste of money and covets its right-of-way:

    http://blogs.northcountrypublicradio.org/inbox/2011/09/07/a-detour-in-the-adirondack-tourist-train-debate/

    The “against” comments sound an awful lot like the people who are against HSR; I wonder if they have grey hair.

    The website for the road itself, which I’ve been told makes an operating profit:

    http://www.adirondackrr.com/

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adirondack_Scenic_Railroad

    D. P. Lubic Reply:

    A word from the anti-rail crowd:

    http://www.adirondackexplorer.org/stories/bikepath.php

    Image search results:

    http://www.google.com/search?pq=adirondack+scenic+railroad&hl=en&sugexp=gsis,i18n%3Dtrue&cp=28&gs_id=8&xhr=t&q=adirondack+scenic+railroad+map&gs_sm=&gs_upl=&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&biw=986&bih=627&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi

    http://www.railpictures.net/showphotos.php?railroad=Adirondack%20Scenic%20Railroad

    Alon Levy Reply:

    Maybe they should require US Highways to include cycle lanes and leave railroads alone.

    synonymouse Reply:

    I couldn’t agree more. Bicycle lanes next to active railroads are not safe. Not long ago a BNSF freight in the Bay Area set something like 5 fires alongside the ROW in quick succession.

    Put bike lanes next to freeways. Also put guvmint offices, MTC in particular, right next to the biggest, smoggiest freeway around so they can get up close and personal with the frankenstein they have created.

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