Ogilvy Quits In Shame Before Being Fired
For a few months now there have been increasing reports of tension between the California High Speed Rail Authority and Ogilvy, the PR firm they hired on a $9 million contract to conduct outreach for the project. In April Quentin Kopp slammed Ogilvy just before he stepped down from the board, raising questions about Ogilvy’s effectiveness, competence, and financial accounting:
One of his last official acts on the board was to send Chief Executive Officer Roelof van Ark a letter urging the authority to terminate a $9 million contract with Ogilvy Public Relations Worldwide.
Ogilvy, with an office in San Francisco, was awarded the contract to handle the rail authority’s public relations in November, 2009.
“Since Ogilvy’s engagement in February 2010, its inadequate performance can be measured, by among other things, the worsening legislative, media, academic and popular comments in the public domain about our project,” Kopp wrote in the letter to van Ark.
So far, Ogilvy has charged the authority more than $2.4 million for little more than a “plan,” Kopp said.
In the letter to van Ark, Kopp details a long list of invoices from Ogilvy he disapproved of including $1,500 spent for someone to read news clips related to the authority for a little more than three hours in April 2010.
In recent weeks, I have heard from sources that Kopp’s criticisms were gaining traction. There’s no doubt that the Authority needs better outreach and PR – almost everyone, friend or foe, has identified it as a core weakness – and Ogilvy clearly wasn’t up to the task.
So Ogilvy, reading the writing on the wall, decided to quit before they could be fired:
The public relations firm making big bucks to sell the state’s $43 billion high-speed rail project quit after finding out it was about to be fired, officials disclosed Thursday.
Ogilvy Public Relations had signed a 4½-year, $9 million contact with the California High-Speed Rail Authority in 2009 but some officials think the firm hasn’t earned the money….
Rail authority leaders had planned to ask the agency’s board on July 14 to fire Ogilvy and search for a new PR firm. But Ogilvy leaders apparently caught wind of the news, first circulated internally on Monday, and by Thursday morning rail authority CEO Roelof van Ark had received the firm’s resignation letter.
I think this says all you need to know about Ogilvy. Facing a board motion to terminate their contract, they chose to quit instead of defend themselves. Ogilvy appears to have simply been sponging off of the Authority, overbilling for crappy work.
Some might take this as an opportunity to criticize the Authority. In reality, this shows that Roelof van Ark and the board run a tight ship and will not accept failure from their contractors. It was clear that Ogilvy was about to be fired, showing that the Authority is serious about accountability and making sure that they are spending money wisely. The impending firing of Ogilvy is a sign of strength for the Authority, not of weakness.
This should also call into question the ridiculous controversy that erupted in 2009 when the PR contract was first being decided. As you may recall, the original contract was to have been given to Mercury Public Affairs, but when controversy erupted over Mercury’s links to former governor Arnold Schwarzenegger, Mercury dropped out after the Authority board demanded a rebidding of the contract.
Would Mercury have failed so spectacularly as Ogilvy? Hard to say. Mercury’s heavy hitters in California political communications might have had better ability and skill at getting the Authority’s side of the project told. They might have been able to stop the bullshit “train to nowhere” lie from getting traction in the press, and might have been able to mount a better defense against the laughably flawed Legislative Analyst’s report. As it turned out, it fell to HSR advocates like myself and Californians For High Speed Rail to discredit that report.
This is an opportunity for the Authority and the HSR project as a whole. The contract will likely be rebid, and hopefully the next winner will actually do their jobs instead of sitting around collecting billings and making their corporate executives rich.
In defense of Ogilvy, overbilling for crappy work is the norm for CHSRA contractors.
Alon Levy Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 5:39 pm
They have to start the purges somewhere.
BruceMcF Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 3:03 pm
And $500/hr to read newsclips on HSR! I would have been happy to do that for only $200/hr.
Alon Levy Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 4:01 pm
Robert does that for free.
BruceMcF Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 4:37 pm
shhhh, here I am offering an 80% discount, and you trying to undercut me with free labor? That’s cold.
Peter Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 4:39 pm
Your offer was only 60%. ;)
BruceMcF Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 5:06 pm
Ah, you are assuming that I read as slowly as the Ogilvy fellow. I was planning to read twice as fast.
Alon Levy Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 4:55 pm
That’s how I roll. I save the deep-but-not-100% discounts for real estate I own.
The other way to read this, Robert, is that sometimes even a powerful PR firm can’t put lipstick on the pig.
I have read Judge Kopp’s letter detailing his accusations.
In general, the billing issues seemed pretty small or with an explanation (travel time + prep time + meeting time > meeting time). What I found more valid was the uber-complaint that things were not going particularly well.
From Judge Kopp’s perspective, he was focused on the messaging aspects. From my perspective, outreach was a disaster and this contract was originally supposed to cover outreach. The website makeover was really problematic – breaking all old links is a no-no for a project like this (including the ones the Authority had used in its FRA applications).
If you send an email in to the Authority from its website contact form, you will not even get an auto-response. Once or twice I have eventually gotten a response. We have tried very hard to work with the authority to improve this basic blocking and tackling and not really gotten anywhere (we have submitted suggestions, spent hours with web team).
All of that said, my understanding is that there was actually a decision coming from the Authority that Ogilvy should focus more on the political and less on what you or I would call outreach. I think this was a giant mistake.
For example, I have never met the person doing “outreach” on behalf of Ogilvy (a subcontractor) for the Bay Area. The main job seems to have been revving up key supporters and backers of the project. While someone at the Authority needed to maintain these types of relationships, this is not outreach. Indeed, from a legal perspective, the person doing outreach from an environmental review is supposed to NOT be a booster. A key issue is that people who were generally favorable to the project failed to raise some key issues that have led to last minute route changes which are what is creating the most public outcry.
The irony would be that if the AUthority manages to spin the story so that all the blame for the outreach fail lands on Ogilvy it will be the best job on PR they have done so far.
Elizabeth Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 9:59 am
Robert,
On another note, I find it really hard to believe that you thought it would be appropriate to have Steve Schmidt of Mercury doing “outreach” for this project.
Seriously, the guy who was Cheney’s spokesman and Rove’s protoge? THe guy who who was considered “aggressive” within the GWB administration?
wiki:
“Schmidt joined the Bush administration as a Deputy Assistant to the President and Counselor to Vice President Dick Cheney. In 2004, he was a member of the senior strategic planning group, led by White House adviser Karl Rove, that ran President George W. Bush’s re-election campaign; Schmidt oversaw the reelection “war room”.[7] In 2005 and 2006, he was the White House strategist in charge of the U.S. Supreme Court nominations of Samuel A. Alito[14] and Chief Justice John Roberts.”
More:
http://rawstory.com/news/2005/Cheney_spokesman_departs_country_as_CIA_1011.html
Robert Cruickshank Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 10:20 am
The CHSRA has every right – and I would argue the obligation – to find people who are effective and competent to carry out their contracts.
And let’s face it, if you look at that list of things he did – run Bush’s re-election, manage two highly controversial SCOTUS nominees – you see someone who is really, really good at what he does.
So yeah, I think it would be totally appropriate for him to be doing outreach. He does his job well. The Authority needs that in order to counter folks like you.
Elizabeth Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 10:35 am
The ends justify the means? What would be too much for you?
Walter Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 11:12 am
If you can sell W’s second term, you can sell HSR. Frankly, I don’t know enough about the guy but I’m open to an effective professional of any political stripe.
I guess if the guy sells HSR well, he’s too biased to appropriately conduct outreach and work on communicating environmental reviews. If he doesn’t, he’s an ineffective waste of money typical of the CHSRA conspiracy to fatten the wallets of consultants and others. It’s just tough–if Robert deserves a grain of salt for spinning everything into good news, the project’s detractors deserve the same for finding ways of painting any news as symptomatic of some terrifying problem with the whole project.
Elizabeth Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 11:19 am
This particular complaint is aimed at Robert who is trying to say that the main problem with Ogilvy is that they weren’t hardball enough.
The Authority (aided by a timely LA Times article that came out the morning of the board meeting http://articles.latimes.com/2009/sep/03/local/me-rail3) decided NOT to hire the guy.
Miles Bader Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 11:54 am
Robert said that Ogilvy were incompetent and/or ignoring their job. That isn’t the same as “not hardball enough.”
Robert Cruickshank Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 12:59 pm
Exactly. Anyone who can get Bush re-elected is clearly competent at their job. That’s all I’m saying and ever did say.
Elizabeth Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 1:01 pm
At public outreach and interactive communication? Or jamming something down people’s throats?
joe Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 1:40 pm
Helping HSR which won 60% support in a public election is helping “We The People” overcome a non-democratic, self-appointed group trying to undermine our democratic process.
Happy July 4th!
VBobier Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 5:21 pm
Yeah, I have to agree Robert, anyone who could get Bush reelected can’t be all bad, Just very competent, Better than Ogilvy I’d say.
Jeff Carter Reply:
July 3rd, 2011 at 10:19 am
Elizabeth: “At public outreach and interactive communication? Or jamming something down people’s throats?”
Well Elizabeth, it’s no different than CC-HSR, CARRD, Boondoggle, Martin Engel, Morris Brown, etc. jamming their anti-HSR propaganda down people’s throats.
It goes both ways!!!
Rick Rong Reply:
July 3rd, 2011 at 10:58 am
To Jeff Carter,
No it doesn’t. Neither CC-HSR, CARRD, Boondoggle, Martin Engel, nor Morris Brown receive state funding, nor do they need to pretend that they are engaged in “outreach,” something that is quite different from advertising.
Robert’s comment, that “Anyone who can get Bush re-elected is clearly competent at their job,” also misses an important point. The “job” done to re-elect someone like Bush is not the “job” a state-paid, public outreach contractor is supposed to do. Selling refrigerators to Eskimos is one thing. Making sure people who would be affected by the project are informed and given reasonable opportunities to participate in the process is something else entirely.
adirondacker12800 Reply:
July 3rd, 2011 at 1:52 pm
Making sure people who would be affected by the project are informed and given reasonable opportunities to participate in the process is something else entirely.
The process has painfully been laid out over the past 40 years of so of legislative action and lawsuits. If you don’t like the current process talk to your legislator. Or sue.
Rick Rong Reply:
July 3rd, 2011 at 7:24 pm
Adirondacker, I don’t have a problem with the process. The question, however, isn’t with the process itself but with how it is implemented. The process is described in the law, so there is no reason to speak to legislators about it. Public outreach is an important part of any public project. If you think Ogilvy did a great job on that score, fine.
adirondacker12800 Reply:
July 4th, 2011 at 12:10 am
Then specifically what has CAHSR done wrong? People have had opportunity to participate in the process, that’s what the comment periods have been for. The comment periods follow public hearings. What have they done wrong?
joe Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 11:47 am
What political test loyalty does CARRD want to administer when awarding public office and public grants?
Miles Bader Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 12:03 pm
“Must not support rail systems that compete effectively with road and/or air transport.”
synonymouse Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 12:57 pm
“Must tom to Palmdale, Corcoran, San Jose, iconic stilts, ad nauseum.”
Peter Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 12:57 pm
“Must not support rail systems that travel down the Peninsula through PAMPA. Altamont is ok.”
synonymouse Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 1:05 pm
Altamont, like Tejon, is way better than “ok”. Maybe Ogilvy simply lost interest in being connected with a cadged-together scheme that proved next to impossible to pimp.
Come on Quentin, you want to dump Ogilvy, how about PB?
Walter Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 1:02 pm
“Must not actually work toward high-speed rail service between Mountain View and Millbrae.”
adirondacker12800 Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 9:40 pm
No one is proposing high speed rail on the Peninsula. Some of the expresses may now and then toy with 125 MPH but that’s particularly high speed these days.
BruceMcF Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 10:36 pm
“high-speed rail service” ~ how fast the train is going on a particular leg of the run is not giong to change the fact that is will be called a HSR service from SF to LA or visa versa. There’s not going to be a chime and an announcement, “we are now going fast enough that you can stop calling this service Rapid Rail and start calling it a bullet train”.
And the US is backward enough in passenger rail that anything appreciably faster than 79mph is certainly “higher speed rail than we are used to”.
adirondacker12800 Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 11:29 pm
If nice electrified track magically appeared between San Jose and Los Angeles tomorrow they could, with some modifications, hook the trains up to diesel locomotives and haul them to Third and King. I’m not sure what he means by “high speed rail service”
If all they ever do between San Jose and Transbay Terminal is install catenary the trains that can go 225 can toddle along the unimproved Caltrain tracks for an hour while they go between San Francisco and San Jose. Well probably more like an hour and half because there will be a Caltrain local on the same track. I’m not sure what he means by “high speed rail service”
Short of building a tunnel from Alviso to San Francisco the really fast trains on the Peninsula qill be going 125. While that’s faster than 79 it’s not what the rest of the world calls high speed rail. I a few select places it what the locals call “commuter rail”
…not that Mountain View is going to have HSR trains stopping at it on a regular basis.
BruceMcF Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 3:16 pm
No, what people will understand by high speed rail service is SF to LA in something around three hours. If you get on the train in SF and get to LA in about three hours, normal people are not going to care whether the train was traveling 125mph or 150mph between SF and San Jose.
wu ming Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 1:10 pm
when one is hiring PR people, as with many analogous contracting jobs, one generally focuses on how well they do the job, not what other clients they have worked for. see also: lawyers, surgeons, etc.
mike Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 2:49 pm
What does Bush’s re-election campaign have to do with anything? You’re hiring a firm to provide a service. They likely also provide that service to people of different political leanings. Would you boycott an office supply store because it turns out Republicans also shop there when buying campaign materials?
VBobier Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 5:27 pm
Now that would be utter stupidity indeed, Good stores are hard to find.
Miles Bader Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 9:21 pm
It’s an attempt by Elizabeth to derail the discussion.
synonymouse Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 11:03 am
Some might enjoy this job evaluation of Kopp:
http://www.altamontpress.com/discussion/read.php?1,59878,59898#msg-59898
OT: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2011/07/01/MNJE1K4SQ7.DTL What happened here?
Eric M Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 12:01 pm
In his veto statement, Brown said funds for BART and other agencies “appear unrelated to the high-speed rail project or an integrated rail plan.”
Good for him. Although $900 million is set aside for other mass transit to help connect with high speed rail, BART is just a leach that sucks money from everything. Glad this was stopped for now.
synonymouse Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 12:47 pm
That’s because BART-MTC sits on the right hand of Pelosi. What’s the union chant: “Power, power, who’s got the power?” If you want to find out have CHSRA try to usurp BART property the way it is usurping Caltrain property. With BART it only works the other way around.
You folks always want to rough up the UP – how about roughing up BART? Aint’ gonna because it and its unions plus the client MTC, run Bay Area transit.
wu ming Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 1:13 pm
your talking points make no sense here. BART just lost funding.
adirondacker12800 Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 1:28 pm
Turing machines don’t have “sense”……
joe Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 1:49 pm
Eliza the rail troll.
synonymouse Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 1:36 pm
What was that quote from Yamamoto(apparently incorrect) about waking the sleeping giant. And this token cut will serve to do is incite BART to “sic” its three DC crones, MTC, Amalgamated, yada yada to lean on Brown.
Quelle blague.
VBobier Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 5:35 pm
NEWS flash Syno: All Railroads and Railways in the US use BLE personnel, want a rail job, Join the Union(BLE).
synonymouse Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 11:37 am
not BART. Amalgamated expects to be treated with kid gloves by Jerry, just like the sacred cow CTA.
Peter Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 12:58 pm
Although BART does seriously need to replace its rapidly aging fleet, a $35 million cut is not going to kill a $3.5 billion project.
trentbridge Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 3:30 pm
“Almost a quarter million people took BART yesterday, setting a record for Sunday ridership at 247,936. That’s 23,477 more than the previous record for a Sunday set June 28, 2008, which not coincidentally, was also a day that combined the Pride Parade and a San Francisco Giants game.”
It looks like BART can buy their own replacement fleet if this ridership spike continues..
Peter Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 1:02 pm
I’m guessing the $4 million cut from HSR bonds for Caltrain electrification were the $4 million that Caltrain was matching for the $16 million federal grant? Does that mean the federal grant goes away, too?
Robert Cruickshank Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 1:04 pm
I get the sense that Brown is upset at Caltrain’s lack of coordination with the Authority and is pushing back against the idea of using Prop 1A and/or other HSR funds simply as candy for existing systems without there being a clear connection to a statewide plan. There is $995 million in Prop 1A for non-HSR systems that connect to the HSR line, and Brown doesn’t appear to be saying that money can never be spent on things like BART and Caltrain, just that those systems shouldn’t expect to go it alone.
synonymouse Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 1:15 pm
He needs to look like he’s cutting something, anything, and this was the low-hanging fruit. When the $4 bil doesn’t materialize, that’s when the excrement will hit the ventilator and PB will have to start thinking of cheaper alternatives in earnest.
Peter Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 1:16 pm
I guess Governor “Moonbeam” is a lot sharper than critics give him credit for…
joe Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 1:48 pm
He is very sharp and doing his job rewarding cooperation and providing a dis-incentive for obstruction.
Since the 1994 bankruptcy, Orange County has gotten a $48 million a year from CA vehicle license fees to help pay back their loans – that is now on the chopping block thanks to their non-cooperative, cut the budget, GOP reps Lou Correa and Don “Spanky” Wagner. Next time I bet they negotiate.
VBobier Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 5:39 pm
Yep, He’s a Shark and He’s swimming among the minnows, chomp, chomp.
wu ming Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 1:15 pm
my totally ignorant armchair quarterback read of this is that brown wanted to make sure that the money was solely being used to aid in making rail connections to CAHSR, not just a pot sweetener to fund HSR connection-unrelated rail projects.
that and because brown generally enjoys vetoing things and looking stern.
Risenmessiah Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 7:50 am
I think your assumption is correct.
Brown is not eager to spend mass transit’s share of Prop 1A until he sees what will go the farthest in helping the overall project along. In his mind, BART was saying, “But what we really, really need to make high speed rail a reality….is new cars!!!! Hey now!”
Seeing how weak CHSRA’s communication was, I often thought: can’t they spare a million or two and have a professional firm do it for them? Then I learn on this page that they did have one!
I didn’t even know that they had a PR firm. That’s how bad they were. I hope the new Department for High Speed Transportation will do away with this waste of money. We need to work faster. Wasn’t the original plan to hit the ground in early 2011?? What happened to that?
I can write well, speak well, have a good eye for illustration, and have some understanding of rail technology and its strong points. How do I get hired as the the PR firm?
I don’t know why we are still talking about any of this. Everyone knows that according to farmers, if trains go to fast it makes california’s happy cows get all sad, and that would mess up everything. Think of the cheese!!! You can’t make cheese with milk from cows who are unhappy about trains that go to fast through the pasture. You just can’t! Plus rumor has it that there isn’t really such thing as a 220mph train. The videos are fake. The communists took video of regular trains and used imovie to speed up the images. Its just like that fake moon landing. besides only homosexuals and terrorists ride trains. Everyone knows that. Michele Bachmans husband told me so.
D. P. Lubic Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 4:45 pm
Jim, I’m going to invite you over to the Infrastructurist. We had a most interesting comment there on the subject of privatizing Amtrak–oh, heck, I’ll let you take a look at it yourself.
This comes from a guy who posts as Henry Porter, and is responding to a number of posts I’ve had in which I argue that the real problem with rail losing out as it has is that the competition has never paid its full costs–something our passenger rail is supposed to do, and what freight rail does (and pays real estate taxes as well). Like Morris and others, he doesn’t think much of rail or public transit. Take a look at this response, and tell us if you think even he is admitting the truth:
Henry Porter says:
July 1, 2011 at 1:22 pm
People,
Get a grip, will you.
The game is, as you put it, “rigged” in favor of the system where the paying customers are. There are SO many more people wanting to travel by car that they are able to spread the – yes – enormous costs over millions upon millions of people. They each pay a very small portion of the cost and the system works.
That’s not the case with passenger rail. The costs are still enormous but there aren’t enough users to pay for it.
Annual highway subsidies, in absolute numbers (dollars), are larger than annual rail subsidies…no question. But, on a unit benefit basis, rail subsidies are orders of magnitude larger than highway subsidies. The return on the highway subsidy investment is so much greater than the return on the passenger rail subsidy, there is really no comparison.
It will take brilliant person indeed to devise a way to spread such high costs over such a small base without huge subsidies, extracted from a large base of people who will never use it, and still make a profit. I have no doubt that it cannot be done.
The people who are smart and bold enough to do profitable passenger rail will never exist.
Want to prove me wrong? Write yourself a business plan. Sell shares. Make a profit. I will eat my words.
jimsf Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 4:51 pm
Not everything is suppose to make a profit. Does NASA make a profit? Does the new york subway make a profit. No profit does not equal no benefit. You can’t argue with these people though. they have rocks in their heads.
VBobier Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 5:42 pm
And evidently are Zombie proof as they seem to lack any real Brains too.
adirondacker12800 Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 6:06 pm
Does the new york subway make a profit?
Yes
…the buses on the other hand, no.
Miles Bader Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 8:00 pm
Your point is well taken, but I’d also bet there are more examples of profitable passenger railways (including capital costs) than profitable highways…
joe Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 8:18 pm
If X makes a profit, sell off and privatize X. If X doesn’t make a profit, cancel it.
Miles Bader Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 8:35 pm
Well there are many more private passenger railways than private road systems…
[Kinda wacky when you consider the modes advocated by outfits like the Reason Foundation are exactly those which suck the most at the public teat!]
D. P. Lubic Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 8:43 pm
Have you observed most of the conservatives/Republicans lately? That whole party seems to have gone wacky! It’s unfortunate, really; you don’t want a monopoly in politics any more than you want one in business, and largely for the same reasons.
joe Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 9:02 pm
you’ll see more lunacy because it’s working.
joe Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 4:55 pm
The per unit cost of a car is … not part of Henry’s world. So who wants to kick Lucy’s football while she holds it?
Consumer reports sez a honda fit is 0.47 per mile, 5 years and 15,000 miles per year. AOL figures total cost of ownership over five years is $26,531.
So free cars verses full cost recovery on trains. I dare ya to prove he’s wrong.
D. P. Lubic Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 5:30 pm
For some reason, this fellow and another one who goes by the name of Get Real have this fixation on unit costs, or costs per mile. Unit costs are important–but they are not the only measure you should use. Here’s what I had to say about this and some other things:
D. P. Lubic says:
June 29, 2011 at 4:53 pm
“How important…how successful…how indispensable is passenger rail?”
Successful enough to require a much smaller subsidy in terms of cost recovery than the road system.
“For all the money thrown at it by people who will never step foot on it…who will never even see it, the average American will take a round trip on an Amtrak train once every 21 years.”
This argument ignores the huge combined subsidy (money over and above that collected from fuel taxes) that the auto system gets, which is more in one year than what has been spent in total on Amtrak in 40 years. And don’t be fooled by some notion of “cost per passenger mile,” which is a variation of unit-cost accounting. You can have a product that has a reasonable demand and makes you rich with very high unit costs–think of Chanel No. 5, which is probably in the hundreds of dollars per gallon range–and you can go broke with a low-unit-cost product if your cost recovery is short–which is a part of why Atlantic-Richfield Oil Company (ARCO) no longer operates east of the Mississippi River in spite of its official name, and in recent decades has been concentrating on chemicals and even coal instead of being a gasoline retailer, as it once visibly was.
http://www.fundinguniverse.com/company-histories/Atlantic-Richfield-Company-Company-History.html
“The market for passenger rail is so infinitesimal, if Amtrak were to end tomorrow, only one in 15,000 people would even notice.”–Henry Porter
Depends on where you live. The NEC and some connecting lines (i.e., the Keystone Corridor) are pretty obvious places where the end of rail passenger service would be missed badly. Less obvious–but no less important in many ways–would be the former Great Northern Empire Builder route. There are times that railroad is a lifeline to the people who live out there, when blizzards close roads and airports and the Builder (and the freight trains of host railroad BNSF) are the only things that can move. Even in less extreme weather, that train carries a lot of people who don’t want to drive across those plains, and the train serves a lot of places that lack air service.
Do you consider those people to be “second class citizens?” Do you consider them “un-American” because they do not worship at the altars of Ford, Sloan, Firestone, and Rockefeller?
If the travel volumes are any indication, the Florida services are worthwhile, and the new service to Lynchburg, Va., is generating an operating surplus.
As to the “rest of the country,” how can they use something that either doesn’t exist, or at runs through in the middle of the night, perhaps only three days per week?
Biggest shortcoming, as I see it, is that your view ignores the future. Oil is going to be unaffordable to use as we do now, a lot of people will not be able to afford new hybrid or electric cars, the funding mechanism for roads is falling apart (gone into in more detail elsewhere on this site [reference to other posts about the shortfalls in the gas tax system]), and a lot of us are facing driving capability problems that either make us uncomfortable or unsafe as we age. I face these last two personally–and self-driving cars will not address the cramping problems and sore knees on longer trips.
And driving itself is no longer the relaxing, pleasant thing it used to be.
If you disagree with the last point, answer this question–how many people do you know still take Sunday drives, just for the fun of driving?
Here’s a link to the current works:
http://www.infrastructurist.com/2011/06/24/in-case-youre-just-joining-us-the-privatize-amtrak-debate/#comments
joe Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 8:22 pm
It’s Lucy holding the football – I would not even try to kick their over-constrained argument against rail.
D. P. Lubic Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 8:30 pm
Ironically, I do think I hit something.
Even that clown had to come around to the truth:
“The game is, as you put it, “rigged” in favor of the system. . .”
That admission, if we could get something like it out of a pro-car, anti-rail politician. . .well, what would you do with it?
Not a whole lot to do with here, but elsewhere. . .?
Darn, I ought to be the new PR firm for the CAHSRA. . . .
Alon Levy Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 11:48 pm
The AAA costs for cars are overstated – they’re basically for chumps who take a huge hit on depreciation and maintain their cars more than the average. See here and here.
D. P. Lubic Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 5:19 pm
Oh, in earlier posts, I’ve had fun with heritage railroads being “socialist” and “Communist,” and run by “environazis.” It’s been especially fun to point this out the ones that are steam-powered, along with a former mainline excursion program. I’ve had joke posts about how these roads are reverse-racist (the steam engines are almost always black, never, ever white), that some are green-washed (Southern’s 4501 wore a green passenger scheme from the 1960s to the early 1990s), how not only a steam locomotive was painted blue, but its whole train was blue, too (Reading & Northern’s excursion locomotive No. 425), and that a couple of engines were “green” (Eureka & Palisade No. 4 is an 1875 Baldwin that runs on wood, and the Grand Canyon Railway has a steamer that is fired with used cooking oil).
The Western Maryland Scenic Railroad, the Cumbres & Toltec, and the Strasburg Rail Road are Communist because their passenger cars are painted red. The East Broad Top, the Cass Scenic Railroad, the White Pass & Yukon, and others are environazis because their passenger cars are painted Pullman green. The people who work on many of these roads are socialistic because they volunteer and get no pay, as if they were in a commune or something. Three roads that I know of–Cumbres & Toltec, Cuyahoga Valley, and the Adirondack Scenic Railroad–are socialist private-public-partnerships, in that their tracks are at least partially government owned (by the US Park Service in the case of the Cuyahoga Valley), but the operators are volunteers (“socialists”)–and they making money so they can come and kill us in our beds!
It’s terrible, just terrible, that some of these heritage roads even perform true “transportation service.” The Strasburg hauls freight, the Western Maryland Scenic and the Cuyahoga Valley have accommodations for bicyclists, the Durango & Silverton carries parts and supplies to a hydropower plant built in 1906 that is still unreachable by road, the D&S and the White Pass carry hikers, hunters, and fishermen to favorite spots with a flagstop service to places that are also unreachable by road, and the Grand Canyon Railway has put a small dent in the auto traffic at the Grand Canyon, and also connects with socialist Amtrak trains at Williams, Az.
I don’t think Henry Porter liked any of this. . .and one really wild (joke) poster thought train travel should be outlawed!
Photo fun, featuring grace and beauty, and a nice, ripe age of 136–Eureka & Palisade No. 4:
http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=357900&nseq=0
http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=335765&nseq=3
Like their locomotives, the railroaders of the 19th century must have been made of iron:
http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=335421&nseq=4
City of Gilroy has a HSR Project Webpage
http://www.gilroyhighspeedtrain.org/
Jon Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 2:14 pm
Quick, someone call Kathy Hamilton!
“Many have suspected this site, http://www.gilroyhighspeedtrain.org whose logo looks amazingly like the California High Speed Rail logo, might be funded by the High Speed Rail organization but proof positive has not surfaced.”
joe Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 3:01 pm
Gilroy is engaging the HSRA to influence the design of the HSR system as it crosses the City and is funding their own, independent study on station placement. The City favors HSR but is still asking hard questions about the layout, impact and cost.
Obviously Gilroy is a front for the CAHSRA, a Potemkin village.
Jesse D. Reply:
July 3rd, 2011 at 5:17 pm
Other than the (in)famous Garlic Festival that’s plastered just about everywhere in the South Bay?
No, really. Garlic ice cream. Never had it, curious to try.
Getting back on topic, I’m pretty sure Gilroy was a stop on the ORIGINAL HSR plan. So why hype it more? Sit back and let the money come to you.
My question is where the three-way split will go (look at a HSR map. There is a “triangle” there. Does that mean CV traffic will have to xfer at Gilroy?)
Miles Bader Reply:
July 3rd, 2011 at 6:26 pm
Pretty much anything can be made into great ice-cream in skilled hands…
[never had garlic ice cream, but I've tried basil ice cream (scrumptious), jalapeno ice cream (great!), black-pepper ice cream (super spicy and drop-dead delicious), etc etc...... Tosci's in Cambridge MA is great for these sorts of interesting flavors...]
What do you expect small to medium companies to do when they see an endless river of money to be collected at the bottom of the waterfall? Billion dollar project says it all.
Consumerreports on California vs Texas energy use: CA uses less overall and obviously per capita winning. HSR will help widen the gap.
D. P. Lubic Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 9:38 pm
Is this properly weighted for the industries of Texas? There are a lot of refineries and chemical plants there, and their energy use is mighty heavy.
Paulus Magnus Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 10:34 pm
Texas also uses more automotive fuel than we do, both absolute and per capita iirc. Remember we have quite a large number of refineries in CA too. For all intents and purposes we supply the Pacific states with refined oil (there isnt a pipeline connection with the rest of the country).
CA cheats a bit on energy use thanks to climate however. We have far less need for heating and AC than the rest of the country.
Alon Levy Reply:
July 1st, 2011 at 11:45 pm
The climate issue can’t be replicated in policy, but it means that it’d be good for the environment for the federal government to reduce the net subsidy from California toward the rest of the US. (Fat chance, I know, but still.)
joe Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 12:06 am
http://www.lbl.gov/Science-Articles/Archive/energy-myths1.html
D. P. Lubic Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 6:43 am
It helps that Hawaii’s climate reduces overall energy demand; everything they would use in the fossil fuel line would have to come via a long sea voyage. This is part of what ultimately made the naval air attack in 1941 a failure; the Japanese admirals got nervous about sending a third wave over (they no longer had the advantage of surprise), and as a result, repair shops and a huge naval oil depot were spared. The carriers and other remaining ships would have been almost worthless without that inventory of oil and gasoline for refueling; we may not have been able to hold that island without that depot.
I wonder how Hawaii will fare later on, as oil becomes more dear. They are working on a light rail line which has been somewhat controversial (translation: Reason and Cato make noise here, too). The web site for the line suggests they are in final stages of the EIS, and are starting some utility relocation.
http://www.honolulutransit.org/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honolulu_High-Capacity_Transit_Corridor_Project
http://www.honolulutraffic.com/
D. P. Lubic Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 6:56 am
Hawaii has a fascinating rail history, most of it written in narrow gauge, but there once was a standard gauge line as well.
http://www.american-rails.com/hawaiian-railroads.html
http://www.hawaiianrailway.com/index.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oahu_Railway_and_Land_Company
D. P. Lubic Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 7:04 am
A bit more:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawaii_Consolidated_Railway
http://www.tsunami.org/newsletter2.html
http://www.google.com/search?q=hawaii+consolidated+railway+wikipedia&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&hl=en&tab=wi&biw=987&bih=628
D. P. Lubic Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 7:20 am
Amazing! Color movie footage from Oahu!
http://www.criticalpast.com/video/65675062970_railroad-station_buildings-along-a-side_train-passing_equipment-loaded-on-train
Crowded commuter train on Oahu:
http://www.criticalpast.com/video/65675037186_cars-and-trucks_passenger-train_railway-crossing_passengers_pullman-cars
wu ming Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 12:39 am
far less need for AC? maybe on the coast, but it gets insanely hot on the other side of the coastal range.
joe Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 12:00 am
I would NOT make excuses for Texas energy consumption. CA tries and we are lampooned for our efforts to save energy and leading environmental laws.
More form CR:
CA needs to continue to lead in energy efficiency and maintain this competitive edge. HSR is a component of that economic edge.
D. P. Lubic Reply:
July 3rd, 2011 at 1:16 am
Don’t you find it interesting that these things and others (including early auto pollution control standards back in the 1960s) passed in California as well? And isn’t it interesting that none of these seem to have generated the controversy that the HSR project has?
Could it be the idea that HSR will knock a dent in the supremacy of cars and oil may have something to do with it, especially if HSR combined with electrified regional and local rail services?
Paulus Magnus Reply:
July 3rd, 2011 at 8:13 am
It’s more to do with a large, extremely expensive project in the middle of a horrible economy and bad budget.
Special for Bruce McF–”White Pass Railroad” (White Pass & Yukon) as performed by the Del McCoury Band:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ajgGo7u9CQk
“All Aboard,” by the same group
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NgLIo0eTc8Q&feature=related
Not railroad related, but great sound (at least I think so as a Blue Grass fan)–”1952 Vincent Black Lightning,” and “Get On Your Knees and Pray.”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YW-w0KgE-8s
Enjoy.
$4 million would have been more than enough to create an incredible pro-HSR campaign and still have enough money to throw in a superbowl commercial. This PR firm shoud have been on the chopping block after 3 months of non-action.
What was so difficult to film an ad supporting HSR? Even in the worst case, they could simply copy how Asian and European railway companies market their high speed service. But, no.
I woul do their job for $ 50/hr and deliver something that even beats Amtrak commercials. It doesn’t take a genius to do an ad. Just someone with talent, a good sense for rhetoric and who takes the best from all ads and puts it together.
joe Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 10:19 pm
They made a bunch of money doing very little work. Epic Win or Fail?
I hope California remembers how poorly they managed this important contract and CA considers their performance when making future awards. For this reason I think it’s worth the CAHSRA’s time and money to officially document the crappy work for the record.
NBC Wonders: Can America ‘Afford Not to’ Spend Billions on High-Speed Rail?
Read more: http://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/kyle-drennen/2011/07/01/nbc-wonders-can-america-afford-not-spend-billions-high-speed-rail#ixzz1R162a4fL
D. P. Lubic Reply:
July 2nd, 2011 at 11:42 pm
And what a bunch of dumb answers in the comments. Every one–every single one!–as critical of the idea as it is ignorant. Very disappointing to read such garbage from my fellow citizens.
And all of them sound so angry! I can’t help but think that this has become the demographic of the old-line networks–old geezers who remember better times, and fail to recognize that those “good old days” had the seeds to our current troubles in them.
And I’m damn angry at the network itself, too. Where was the analysis of the true cost of the road system, the true cost of gasoline, and the generational shift from cars by younger people that has been discussed here at some length?
Hey, I want that PR job for CAHSR, too, and I would certainly be decent at it–better than what the pros seem to be capable of doing. Sheesh!!
political_incorrectness Reply:
July 3rd, 2011 at 12:47 am
I would like it too, just pay the living expenses and minimum wage and I bet I could do a heck of a better job on the PR side and probably many of us here could do better. Why not hire some of us who actually educate ourselves on the matter, know how to interact with the public (KEY ITEM), and keep the message consistent.
We should have a lovely page on the common arguments.
1) The private sector should fund it. A: Currently, roadways are funded by the federal, state, and local governments. A higher standard for passenger rail is not fair unless other transportation modes are funded the same way. It would be exactly saying that the private sector needs to finance the road to your house.
2) No high speed rail system would ever attract enough riders to cover the operating costs A: Let me see, Spain, France, Russia, Japan, Taiwan, England, and the semi-speed Acela make operations surpluses.
3) We’re flat f’ing broke as a nation A: We have about a 100% Debt to GDP ratio, so why has Japan not grinded to a hault?
4) HSR is good only for moving people and that makes it a ridiculous waste of money. A: Again what about those roads to your house? Most of the time, they are good for your movement of personal vehicles to and from your house.
5) Ridership forecasts were called flawed by UC Berkley A: UC Berkley would have used a different approach but did not call the projections flawed
6) The LAO Reports are scathing against the HSRA A: They are flawed reports based off someones opinion
Anyone else care to add to the common myths?
synonymouse Reply:
July 3rd, 2011 at 11:18 am
The hinterlands are restive:
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/07/03/county-supervisor-proposes-51st-state-cut-out-southern-california/
I wonder when “Jefferson” will resurface as well. There is profound dissatisfaction with the direction that California has been taking. Prop 1A could not pass now.
The CHSRA needs to come up with a bare-bones default scheme along the lines suggested by Tolmach and TRAC.
1. Ditch the Palmdale detour and any other Las Vegas oriented treachery.
2. Divorce Caltrain and let the latter and BART duke it out in the open for territorial supremacy.
3. Put all the funding into closing the Bako-LA gap.
D. P. Lubic Reply:
July 3rd, 2011 at 12:38 pm
Looking at some more contemporary material:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NiXb5mQ9Gp8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NiXb5mQ9Gp8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DksGi7B5BdM
D. P. Lubic Reply:
July 3rd, 2011 at 12:18 pm
political_incorrectness,
I would add information that the road system does not pay for itself, and that there are other costs in oil dependency (including expensive military actions that might not be necessary, or at least could be reduced considerably, even if some suggest our “world policeman” role requires action there for the good of the world). This, and the traffic conditions and the general volatility of oil prices, should make us question whether we can continue the status quo.
On the positive side, railroads have spaciousness, the possibility of assorted multi-task options, including working and/or eating (and JimSF, no food fight this time, even if I think food service is important for this job), and greater speed, safety, and comfort. This high-speed service will also be electric, and electricity will likely be available when both gasoline and aviation fuel are either unaffordable or unavailable.
And trains are cool. . .hmm, how could we work that in with some classic movie images?
Something to start the creative juices flowing–variations on a classic Johnny Mercer tune:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5maV2ziZcA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jh3F_3oa3ts
D. P. Lubic Reply:
July 3rd, 2011 at 12:49 pm
Bah, this was supposed to be here:
Looking at some more contemporary material:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NiXb5mQ9Gp8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NiXb5mQ9Gp8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DksGi7B5BdM
[Reply]
Bombardier has delivered its 700th AGC regional train.
Links:
Rail Journal , Bombardier AGC page
Regional agencies relied on SNCF for the bidding and specifications.
Many of the trains are “bibi” (bi-mode: diesel and electric, and bi-current: AC/DC). Modes can be switched while running, which makes them hybrid.
The trains are articulated as the SNCF wanted them to be indeformable. Articulation also allows continuous low floor and a low center of gravity. Another advantage is that cars can be wider since their ends do not stick out in tight curves, which would be a problem in some stations whose platforms are not straight.
I wonder why American agencies spurn economies of scale and keep ordering trains separately at ridiculous prices. Surely, if French socialists and conservatives (who hate each other) can get together to save taxpayer money, it should also be possible in the US.
D. P. Lubic Reply:
July 3rd, 2011 at 1:03 pm
Some comments that might tie in to this:
http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2011/07/03/in-chinas-high-speed-successes-a-glimpse-of-american-difficulties/
I hope CA has a long memory and never forgets how much damage the AWOL Ogilvy PR firm has cost CA HSR. The most inane talking points against rail are floated as “fact”.
http://www.presstelegram.com/opinions/ci_18399344
Arthur Dent Reply:
July 3rd, 2011 at 4:59 pm
CA has no memory for poor performance. It has already forgotten the damages of PB. There’s no memory, no repercussions, and bad behavior is repeated ad nauseam at taxpayers’ expense. Very few people care, and the ones that do speak up get labeled.
Ogilvy will continue doing its thing, the CHSRA will sign into its next dysfunctional contract, and PB will continue cashing its checks.
Arthur Dent Reply:
July 5th, 2011 at 11:53 am
One more: The Authority will continue to make lame excuses for not producing a real business plan.
They submitted their RFP a year ago, didn’t enter into a contract until June (of this year), yet the financial plan is due in October. Good luck with that one.
The Legislature will continue to wring their hands, castigate them in public, but give them their money no matter what.
And we’ll keep reelecting them even as they term out into higher office.
Mike Reply:
July 5th, 2011 at 11:25 am
I guess they’re going to re-bid this PR outreach contract and award it to another firm, but outreach and communications is one of a short list of government functions that should be done by government employees. It’s fine to contract out for engineering services (not that the Authority has done a good job of this, but in general it’s a reasonable thing for governments to procure on a contract basis), but community outreach is so close to the essentially governmentmental policymaking function that it is just a bad idea to ever contract it out to a private firm.