Ensuring California HSR Doesn’t Become The Next Seattle Monorail
One of the more typical and predictable journalistic responses to the new HSR cost estimates is from the San Jose Mercury News:
Those hoping to ride the state’s high-speed train next decade will have to dig much deeper into their wallets than officials originally thought, a harsh reality that will chase away millions of passengers, according to an updated business plan released Monday.
Of course, as we pointed out, the estimated higher fares are entirely optional. The CHSRA could still have train fares at 50% of airfares if they wanted to. But since they believe they need more private funding, that means a need for more fare revenues, even at the expense of ridership, and so they’re contemplating setting fares at 83% of airfare. As I explained yesterday, I think that’s the wrong choice – but it is a choice.
And there’s a crucial underlying factor that explains this choice. From the same Mercury News article:
Authority Deputy Director Jeff Barker said while the numbers have changed, the “spirit of what the people voted for” with Proposition 1A remains the same.
“What they voted for was to put $9 billion toward construction of a high-speed rail system,” Barker said. “That’s still what we have today. We’re not asking the voters for additional money.” [Emphasis mine.]
Barker is reflecting the political assumption that there’s no way at all that any more money can be generated to pay for the project from public sources, and that private sources are the only way to make up the difference, and that we have to sacrifice ridership in order to pay those private investors.
I think we can all agree that for the time being, it’s probably accurate that California can’t pony up any more funds for HSR, not until we’ve resolved the budget crisis. But several years down the line, the state may be in a much better position to help support the project, and could well afford to kick in a few extra billion. And of course, the federal government should be able to kick in much more than just $2.5 billion a year nationwide, or the paltry but welcome $8 billion in one-time HSR stimulus funds.
However, when transit planners assume public resources are scarce, they tend to make bad decisions as a result. Sometimes the decision is to hide the true cost until well into construction, then say “surprise!” and force a politically difficult bailout – the Big Dig model. Or they feel forced to build an inferior system in order to make the money go farther, which is one charge that’s often leveled at BART.
Another option is to go to voters with a financial ask that is too low, and then try and finance the difference, jeopardizing the project as a whole. That’s a model I have some familiarity with, having watched it happen in Seattle earlier this decade with the rise and fall of the monorail project.
The Seattle Monorail Project was a genius of an idea. Generated from the people, against the wishes of the political establishment, it was an early form of 21st century transit activism that argued the best way to build mass transit affordably in a dense, geographically constrained city like Seattle was to, in the words of its backers, “rise above it all” with a monorail.
Although monorails have been the object of scorn and derision since most people know them either from Disneyland or The Simpsons, this project was more credible in its ridership numbers and technology. In 1997 and in 2000, Seattle voters approved two different initiatives to create and fund a monorail proposal, and in 2002 city voters were asked to approve a Motor Vehicle Excise Tax (MVET) to fund construction of a “Green Line” from Ballard to downtown Seattle to West Seattle, a corridor currently lacking mass transit, at a cost of about $2 billion. The tax narrowly passed with a 1% margin of victory. Construction was to begin in 2005, and an opening date of 2007 was projected.
However, the monorail project had set the MVET too low. Worried that a higher tax would fail at the ballot box, they proposed a 1.4% MVET, instead of something closer to 2% as had been recommended. The result was that as tax receipts began coming in during 2003 and 2004, revenues were about 2/3rds below projections. The project had a genuine funding shortfall, and no real answer how to close it.
Meanwhile, opposition to the project had grown, from a few folks who claimed that an Interstate 5 corridor should be used to downtown developers who were flipping out that trains might pass by the 4th story windows of their tenants. Since the city’s political establishment had never bought into the monorail concept, they didn’t feel moved to defend it, and Seattle Mayor Greg Nickels even convinced the council to deny the use of city streets for the monorail project. And the project opponents began making noise about a vote to repeal the MVET that had been so narrowly approved in 2002.
Afraid that they couldn’t get voters to agree to close the funding gap, the monorail board sought a number of solutions. They pushed back completion to 2009, and explored opening a shorter “starter line” with the promised full route to open some time after that. They also explored a bond financing model that would have saddled the agency with $9 billion in interest, 450% of the construction cost. Hostile media outlets like the Seattle Times breathlessly reported on the financing plan as a sign that the monorail had become a “boondoggle” that should be killed.
Cornered and friendless, the monorail board felt compelled to go back to voters in the November 2005 election – but NOT with a plan to raise more revenues. Instead they proposed to shorten the line and add the complete route at a later date. In an election where the monorail was outgunned on the campaign trail by an avalanche of developer money, 65% of voters rejected the plan. And even though they were still collected MVET revenue and had even bought property along the ROW, the Seattle Monorail Project chose to fold. They fired their staff, sold the property, terminated the MVET, and officially went out of business in early 2008.
I voted for both the 2002 and the 2005 monorail initiatives, but wasn’t surprised the 2005 initiative failed. The monorail board had made some poor decisions, from making an ask that was too low in 2002 to undermining their project’s credibility in 2004 and 2005 with more and more complex and costly plans to deal with the funding crisis. The board’s leadership was notoriously aloof, and their inability to effectively communicate with the public didn’t help matters. The lack of meaningful support from city, county, and state government didn’t help either. As an independent authority, the monorail board wound up lacking the political buy-in it desperately needed, especially in 2005 when it began circling the drain.
Ironically enough, the need to build mass transit on the Ballard-West Seattle corridor remained obvious to everyone, and Mike McGinn made a promise to build light rail on that route a cornerstone of his winning campaign for mayor last month. It will probably cost more than $2 billion to build that project, and since light rail would be on the streets, it would provide slower travel times than the monorail would have.
In other words, despite the monorail project’s flaws, Seattle will have to build high capacity passenger rail on that corridor eventually. And the city is going to spend more money to do it than they would have on the monorail. (Of course, had the Forward Thrust plan been approved in 1970, the city would have had a modern heavy rail system for only $500 million.)
There are any number of similarities between the Seattle monorail project and California high speed rail, from the issues finding complete funding to the lack of solid political support in the state legislature.
But there are also important differences. Unlike monorail, high speed rail is a flagship project of the current presidential administration, and more and more members of Congress and other stakeholders understand that HSR is a necessary part of our nation’s future. Whereas monorail was an untested technology never built on the scale Seattle was proposing, HSR is an off-the-shelf technology with plenty of global expertise on how to build this the right way, on time and on budget.
Still, it’s clear that California HSR needs to avoid some of the core mistakes made by the Seattle monorail. The #1 mistake to avoid is panicking and making stupid choices when you’re concerned about funding. Maybe the Seattle monorail would have died anyway if they had asked for an increase in the MVET, but we know that their attempts to survive without such an increase killed the project anyway.
California HSR should not be afraid to return to voters with a clear and honest ask for more funds when the time comes. Such an outcome is preferable to cutting back on system features, stations, or segments. It’s preferable to setting fares so high that ridership fails to materialize, setting in motion a series of other difficult problems. It’s preferable to bringing in too much private investment that would force setting those fares too high.
Of course, some of this discussion is theoretical. There is a level of private investment that is acceptable (probably around 20%) and it’s entirely possible that the CHSRA can build a good system without ever having to ask California voters for another dime. The Authority has been honest in its cost projections, even when duplicity might have caused them fewer political problems. That’s a very good sign for the project’s future, including its financial future.
The best solution to this is to have a robust federal funding source for HSR, so that California neither has to seek private funding nor has to ask voters to plunk down even more money. All of us should begin organizing to achieve the goal of stable, sustainable, long-term federal funding for HSR. But we should at least keep in mind the possibility that at some future date, we might have to indeed ask California voters for more money to complete the system.
We should not be afraid of that prospect, and neither should the CHSRA. Instead we should all strive for openness and accuracy in cost projections and discussions, to build a sense among voters that the project is well managed. Those are good goals in and of themselves, but they are also necessary pieces in the event that we need to put a proposition on the 2016 ballot to generate the funds to finish up the system properly.

I don’t get the San Jose Merc. It’s not a HSR friendly newspaper.
You’d think they’ed be all over a local issue like HSR but recent stories they carry seem to be poorly researched, like repeating press releases misinterpreting the Judge’s ER ruling in the recent lawsuit.
You have to dig around the internet to find enough data, facts and opinions to explain the HSR dynamics. The Merc’s stories just don’t add up. Wasn’t HSR killed already by the Judge?
I have a novel notion, when I commuted on cal-train from SF to MTV, I bought and read a newspaper. Public transit is their friend, maybe the Mercs’ owners/editors think public ridership is poor, illiterate and not their customer.
Walter Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 12:18 am
Let’s not kill the messenger (the Mercury News). I am discouraged by the announcement that the SF-LA fare is going to be double what they had projected. I figure the CHSRA wouldn’t include such obviously disheartening news in the document if they didn’t plan to act on it.
The SJMN merely said that riders will have to “dig much deeper into their wallets than officials originally thought.” This is true–I had counted on paying $55, not $105 to get between SF and LA. The Mercury News alsos say that this will “chase away millions of passengers.” We can quibble with the “millions” as a number, but not as the underlying concept. The CHSRA say that this price point will reduce overhead. In English, they fully intend to chase away passengers, as compared to 50% pricing. I won’t argue with the economics of it, but it is shoddy policy to restrict the ridership base right out of the gate. It certainly isn’t a model for long-term success.
In sum, the 83% announcement sucks, but let’s not imply that reporting this as troubling news for the state and a large portion of the group of would-be riders is somehow shoddy journalism.
Robert Cruickshank Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 6:57 am
I don’t think the 83% of airfare announcement is “troubling news for the state.” It’s a projection I disagree with, and one I plan to fight. The final decision about fare levels isn’t going to be made for a while – perhaps not until the middle of the next decade – so there is plenty of time to push back against the Authority on this.
This post is designed in part to lay out the rationale we’ll need to use to begin that pushback. The CHSRA is basically afraid of going back to voters to ask for more money. I fully agree that now is absolutely NOT the time to do that. But 5 or 6 years down the line, it might be precisely the right moment to do so. If that’s what it takes to keep fares low, then it should at least be on the table.
Walter Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 10:42 am
I’m 100% with you. The Authority has another 10 years to make sure wisdom prevails–let’s build a train system that attracts a higher number of riders, not a more profitable number of riders.
lyqwyd Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 11:19 am
Let’s not forget that inflation would put that $55 fare at about $74 dollars (in 2020, assuming 2.5% average annual inflation), so the real increase in fare is about 42% when comparing apples to apples (as opposed to the 83% figure, which is really apples to oranges). Still not the way I would go, but not nearly as severe as people think.
” a harsh reality that will chase away millions of passengers, according to an updated business plan released Monday.”
you gotta be kidding me with this. who wrote the article, a journalism school intern who’s mommy still packs his lunch box?
oh no! harsh reality! The future costs more than the present! Oh no! run for your lives! I can’t even believe I’m living in the same country I grew up in. What happened? When did this happen? When did people get like this?
I just want to make sure I’m understanding what I’m witnessing. Okay, so you mean to tell me that a report came out that claims that adjusted for inflation a rail fare that is 50 dollars in today’s dollars will be more than 50 dollars in future dollars when adjusted for inflation….. and so called “journalists” who have the immense responsibility of keeping the population accurately informed of issues so as to help maintain an educated voting public which is needed for a properly functioning democracy, are going to then read said report and come to the conclusion that “a harsh reality [that] will chase away millions of passengers, according to an updated business plan released Monday.” and do so with a straight face and zero ability to properly digest and interpret the information….
and this is then approved as accurate news by the editor of a major urban newspaper. do i have the right?
No wonder the country is in the toilet. ( diane feinstein and joe leiberman being only the tip of the iceberg this week – hello annoyed as hell)
I give up.
have at it. o stupid americans. the ride you are enjoying is the swirling of the water in the commode.
I’d love to blame the Merc for this, but I’m not too happy as well. They’re going to settle for a 30 percent drop in ridership to save 5% in operating costs overall? I hope it’s a choice that doesn’t stick.
Robert Cruickshank Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 6:54 am
It’s a choice we can and should push back hard against. Decisions about fares won’t be made for many years to come. This is an indicator of where they might go, but we have plenty of time to fight it.
jimsf Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 11:44 am
ITs absurd to even discuss fares at this point for the simple fact that no one has any idea what kind of economy we will have 20 years from, no one knows what the value/strength of the dollar will be in 20 years, no one has any idea what oil and electricity will cost in 20 years, and no one knows what wages, and the state’s median income will be in 20 years.
The only answer to what fares will be in 20 years is that they will comparable to other options.
I could not post yesterday – perhaps discussed already… perhaps not.
Original ridership numbers were high relative to planned service levels. Trains would have been packed, and/or, lots and lots of short trips were anticipated. I imagined overhead bars and straps for standees. If I uttered any question about rider numbers… it was for that reason and not because theoritical demand was not there.
Higher fares are welcome… they are still cheap relative to the convienience.
It seems CAHSR will be run like the TGV, favoring profitability over ridership.
More and more people in France think that yield management is in complete opposition to the notion of public service. It often leaves lower-income people no other choice than driving when they can’t plan their trip in advance.
As driving is cheaper in California than in France (where many highways are private), even more people will choose to drive.
It seems that, just like the TGV, CAHSR has chosen to be a business rather than a public service.
Is it what Californians voted for?
Robert Cruickshank Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 7:05 am
Driving is cheaper *for now*. It is highly unlikely to remain cheaper over the coming years as peak oil begins to be felt in full force.
This question of how HSR is run – favoring profitability or ridership – is a very, very important question. We haven’t dealt with it much yet, but clearly that time has now come. As a public entity, the CHSRA can be made to do what we want it to do. We can and should organize to ensure that ridership is the goal. After all, looking at the chart I posted on the Monday business plan post, there isn’t a huge difference in revenues between 50% of airfare and 83% of airfare, whereas there IS a huge difference between the ridership levels.
AndyDuncan Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 9:50 am
I personally think we’re going to see mass market electric cars in the next 10 years, and represent a majority of cars on the roads in 20-30 years. That causes a huge problem for freeway infrastructure because while electrics are expensive, and likely will retain a price premium over gasoline cars for the foreseeable future, the incremental cost of driving once the car is purchased is much, much lower. That means more cars on the road.
Unless we switch all our freeways to toll roads (not a bad idea, since gas tax revenue is only going to decline), the price of driving is going to go down, and the time it takes to get somewhere is going to go up.
HSR won’t need to, or be able to compete with the cost of driving, but the time it takes to drive anywhere is going to become unworkable.
jimsf Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 11:45 am
There aren’t going to be any mass market electric cars. No one wants them.
AndyDuncan Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 11:56 am
People will love them. When’s the last time you took your washing machine in for an oil change? They’ll be cheap to run, last forever and have enough torque to pull tree stumps. What’s not to love? Charging will become a non issue, there will be plugs at parking meters. McDonalds will resell electricity in their parking lots, or maybe even let you top up for free with your combo meal. Car sharing companies like ZipCar will love them as putting charging stations at their parking spaces solves the biggest problem with car sharing: who fills up the tank?
People like the freedom of having a car, most of them don’t actually like their cars.
When electrics become popular, we’re screwed, you can fill one up for $2. We’re not prepared for a world where the cost of driving is one cent per mile. It’s going to be horrific.
Alon Levy Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 11:59 am
Why do you think electrics will last forever? And why do you think charging will be so much quicker than it is today?
AndyDuncan Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 12:14 pm
The same reason that trains last longer than busses: electric motors have a much longer life than internal combustion engines. There’s fewer moving parts. Most electric cars will use a simple, sealed reduction gearbox. No need for a clutch or a torque converter or insanely complicated 8 speed transmissions (which are today more complicated than the engines they’re attached to). There’s no coolant. No user-serviceable oil. All the accessories are electric and self-contained, which means no belts or timing chains to fail. There’s no emissions systems and O2 sensors to get fouled. The only consumable maintenance items are going to be brakes, tires, and windshield washer fluid.
As far as batteries go, they are the expensive and disposable part right now, but they keep getting better and cheaper, and while we may be approaching the physical limits of power density, there’s no indication that we’re hitting some sort of physical limits to making them cheaper and more durable.
Charging speed continues to increase, even today with current batteries the limits aren’t the battery technology, it’s how much power you can get through a plug. 440v charging stations combined with parking meters aren’t science fiction, and they aren’t expensive, at least not compared to the cost of putting in a gas station.
They’re going to run for 500k miles and we’re going to have traffic like you never dreamed of. I don’t know “who killed the electric car” but I’d buy him a beer if I could.
Alon Levy Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 2:47 pm
Trains last longer than buses because of the outside electrification, and because of the lower friction of steel wheels. Rubber-tired trains require extensive repairs to last as long as steel-wheeled trains, and trolleys don’t last forever.
AndyDuncan Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 2:58 pm
So you’re saying that electric cars won’t last any longer than internal combustion cars? Or are you just being pedantic about my “forever” comment?
Alon Levy Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 5:50 pm
I’m not saying they won’t last longer. I think they should last longer, but not much longer – definitely not long enough to cost less per year of use.
jimsf Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 12:57 pm
yes Ive been hearing that for the last 30 years.
AndyDuncan Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 1:30 pm
well, we’ve been hearing that high speed rail is 10 years away for 30 years too.
Alon Levy Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 2:48 pm
High-speed rail is running successfully in multiple countries. Electric cars are nowhere more than a niche market.
BruceMcF Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 6:05 pm
We’ve had dirt cheap oil for yonks. Last time the price of gas was anywhere near the level it reached in 2007 (never mind 2008) in real terms was the early 1980’s, before Saudi Arabia opened the spigots and drove down the price of crude oil.
High Speed Rail does not need a generally distributed energy distribution infrastructure, just one for the precise corridor it runs on, so it faces less network economies lock-in than electric versus gasoline cars.
One big factor if we switch to electric cars, though, if that the massive hidden subsidies in our crude oil-fired transport system are built in part on cross-subsidies created by charging all drivers for roads that provide the strongest subsidy for suburban sprawl development. Its a lot harder to replicate that for electric cars. And if there is not the same systematic direct subsidy, cross-subsidy and hidden subsidies, the “love’ of the car is an experiment yet to be tried – if people love their cars for the freedom they provide, that freedom is in the context of parking spaces exporpriated from property owners and a complex flow of funds made “necessary” by the driving itself. Love of freedom as in free ride may not translate into love of freedom as in free to pay your own way.
adirondacker12800 Reply:
December 17th, 2009 at 11:57 pm
You must be too young to remember the High Speed Ground Transportation Act of 1965
President Johnson had this to say “We have airplanes which fly three times faster than sound. We have television cameras that are orbiting Mars. But we have the same tired and inadequate mass transportation between our towns and cities that we had 30 years ago.” so he was comparing things to 1935. Second generation of Metroliners was supposed to run in revenue service at 165…..
adirondacker12800 Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 11:50 am
Assuming the electric cars can drive from SF to LA or Fresno to SF and back on one charge or have rapid recharge. Technology isn’t there yet and may never be. ( Not a good idea to have a few hundred amps of electricity laying about the filling station ) Electric cars would send more riders to HSR because their cars wouldn’t be capable of going all the to wherever.
jimsf Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 1:00 pm
There are about 55 out of 58 counties in californian full of people who have no use for such cars. When I had my house at 4k ft in the sierra, my 4wd truck could barely get up there. Id love to see someone try to get up there in an electric car.
jimsf Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 1:08 pm
where it will and wont work
Alon Levy Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 2:49 pm
Actually, electric motors are better at climbing grades than gas-powered engines. That’s why San Francisco’s kept the trolleybuses – nothing else could climb all those hills.
adirondacker12800 Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 3:05 pm
…the cable cars did….
Alon Levy Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 5:50 pm
And SF replaced them with trolleys because they climb the hills better.
adirondacker12800 Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 11:46 pm
“Nothing else” is different than “better”.
jimsf Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 11:46 pm
It has nothing to do with climbing the hills. It has to do with the need for snow tires, chains and 4wd in the weather and mud, and the fact that those people do not live like we do. I know because I have been one of them. They have no interest in driving anything but a truck or suv and and anything smaller is not practical if you live in the mountains, or if you work on a farm, or ranch, or own your own business, or own, breed, raise, or ride horses or have anything to to with with anything that grows or walks on all fours.
You may be surprised to know that the majority of californians’ daily lives do not involve going from the cubicle to the gym to the spa to the cocktail party.
jimsf Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 11:48 pm
and even the depths of urbane luxury living, you’re never gonna see the stars showing up at the red carpet in smart cars either.
Alon Levy Reply:
December 17th, 2009 at 12:02 am
Adirondacker: well, it was keep the trolleys or the cablecars – going to diesel like everywhere else was a nonstarter.
And Jim, there are farmers all over the world who get along without SUVs and trucks. Small business owners are likely to live in a city, and if this city has decent transit they may not own a car.
wu ming Reply:
December 17th, 2009 at 6:48 am
if one can design an electric car, they can design an electric truck.
jimsf Reply:
December 17th, 2009 at 10:21 am
you guys are dreaming. Like I said I frew up with these people and the do not want anything to do with the liberal ideas and policies of los angeles and san francisco.
AndyDuncan Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 9:44 am
Like the TGV, or the Shinkansen, or Acela, or Taiwanese HSR. I think profitability should be maximized regardless of what proportion of private investment is attained. If the state makes money on HSR, they can use that money to expand it and to improve feeder systems like Caltrain, Metrolink, the Capitols and the Surfliners.
What we need is some sort of assurances that the profits will go to more rail infrastructure, not to the general fund.
the actual elephant in the room here is how absurdly high plane fares will be by the time that the HSR opens, because of oil price spikes. 50% of what, one wonders. i just hope we have a non-oil-based alternative in place by the time that gas goes over $5 a gallon.
the seattle experience is certainly worth keeping in mind. it kills me that that city shot itself in the foot so many times, when it is so freaking perfect for mass transit.
Robert Cruickshank Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 7:43 am
Seattle finally got it right in 2008 when they passed a tax increase to fund mass transit, but as I noted in the post, the old monorail corridor – Ballard to West Seattle – is going to be built as a slower and probably costlier at-grade light rail, at least if Mayor Mike McGinn has anything to say about it.
It’s possible that the rising price of oil will make airfares unaffordable for most folks anyway, and that the CHSRA will be able to find a balance between raising revenue and maximizing ridership. One of the lessons of the 2008 airline crisis was that short-haul flights are the first on the chopping block if oil prices rise unsustainably.
Let’s look at a scenario. Suppose $0.5b spent from bonding directly on project costs (AFAIR its capped below that, but I forget where, and anyway that errs on the side of caution.
California gets $2b in ARRA at a 50:50 match, or $2b:$2b (because Florida came through on transit rail and the DoT is compelled to carry through on the quid pro quo in order to retain that bargaining chip in the future) … and because of the state bond authority, half of the $2.5b for HSR over the next six years, assuming that the current budget deal is entrenched into the Transport reauthorization … six years at an 80:20 match or $7.5b:$1.875b (while new I-states can get a 90:10 match, 80:20 is the highest that rail has had available to date).
That is, $2b ARRA and $7.5b regular transport appropriation = $9.5 federal and $2b ARRA state match and $1.875b regular transport funding match = $3.875b. Add the $0.5b project costs assumed above, its $4.375b state bonding authority expended and $13.875b spent.
Projected project cost, $43b – $13.875b = $29.125b to go, with $4.625b bonding authority still available. Presumably the big tunneling projects are now all planned but of course not yet started.
At a 80:20 match, that’s a total cost of $23.125b that can be funded on federal funding and the state bond for matching funds at an 80:20 match. If its to be spend over 4 years, California’s federal funding needs to be $4.625b/year … over five years, $3.7b/year. So that is looking at raising the HSR federal funding toward the $10b/year level to have enough other corridors rolling out to build that coalition.
The additional funding requirements is $6b. Clearly if no private finance at all were to be available, the project could still be finished by finishing from the CV to one of the main metro areas, start running services, and then issue revenue bonds to make the balance of the state match. At 80:20 match, the state match is $1.2b, which is something the CV to LA segment could certainly generate the business to firm the ridership projections enough to allow revenue bonding.
And if the service operation is franchised and the franchisee is responsible for bringing the trains to the party, there’ll be some billions in rolling stock that would represent private finance.
Run the numbers again on a 90:10 Interstate Highway match, and there’s no gap at all that requires finance. Run the numbers again on a 75:25 match, and the gap widens. Run it on a 50:50 match – the Governator Precedent system – and massive private investment is required.
Look to the match formula at this point, not the total amounts, because the big spending can quite reasonably be placed in the transport authorization after the coming one – establishing the precedent on the state match is where the action is right now.
here’s another ridiculous article that compares future rail fare with today’s airfare. freakin stupid.
“there isn’t a huge difference in revenues between 50% of airfare and 83% of airfare”
Private investors will see a difference. Choosing profitability over ridership means running fewer trains and hiring fewer employees. This is the TGV’s solution. It is investor-friendly but not really user-friendly.
jimsf Reply:
December 16th, 2009 at 11:48 am
or the private investor idea will be scrapped and itll be turned over to amtrak california where federal backing will mean no pressure for profit and focus will instead be on providing the best level of public transportation.
My prediction is that after the the first “private” operating contractor pulls out, this is what will happen.
Meanwhile, across the ponds, our european brothers and sisters have not only built a trans european network, but are now coordinating schedules across operators.
It’s funny I remember reading about the Seattle Monorail project years ago. Then I read an article that they had got their first light rail line and I was wondering what had happened. That’s a very interesting story and its a bummer it didn’t work out. It would have been interesting to see.
Why do transit organizations shoot low when trying to raise money for transit projects? I mean say the CAHSRA would have asked for 19.9 Billion in bonds. Do you think people really care about 20 vs. 10 Billion? I mean would that have sacrificed the ability to get it passed? Just curious I mean billion is a hard number to conceptualize.
I’m from Seattle, and it’s sad that the monorail didn’t go through, but you get the story a little wrong. Mayor Nickels was in favor of it until almost the very end, when it became clear that it was going to cost several times the original figure. Also, you say “It will probably cost more than $2 billion to build that project, and since light rail would be on the streets, it would provide slower travel times than the monorail would have.” However, Seattle’s Link Light Rail is more metro than light rail, mostly grade-separated.