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I work in the border between France and Spain in a 42km HSL which will connect the two countries. Due to the complexities (compatibility issues, countries involved, French, Spanish and some English and Catalan language involved, etc) the cost is higher, around $30m/mile (with my own numbers).
We also have an 8,4 km tunnel which logically has increased the cost.

Thanks to all the comments to our new lines. Working from here I do not see it as ideal as it looks like, but certainly we can be a little bit proud of it. :)

thank you for the real-world reality check. I suspect that at some point – or points – in UPRR’s 146-year history, they’ve had to deal with serious derailments that fouled adjacent tracks and led to follow-on accidents. They don’t need to make this stuff up, they’ve been there done that.

CHSRA hasn’t. A little humility on operational issues would really go a long way.

@ spokker -

not to belabor the now-closed Altamont vs. Pacheco debate, but the only alternative that was ever considered both functionally and environmentally viable was variation (not love potion :-) #9. It called for all trains to get to Fremont and points east via the South Bay. Specifically, via SJ Diridon.

The estimated San Jose-LA line haul penalty was 10 minutes. The estimated SF-LA line haul penalty was 40 minutes. Ostensibly, this was because trains would need to change direction in San Jose. However, that process does not take 30 minutes – even for a full-length (1320′) train.

Moreover, the analysis showed that trains bound for Sacramento would only dwell in San Jose for 20 minutes. In other words, someone probably tweaked the data to make Altamont #9 look worse than it really would have been.

Moving the station to Santa Clara would have reduced the SF-LA line haul penalty to perhaps 8 minutes. Considering CHSRA’s own analysis of interregional trips in 2030 and allowing that some southbound trains would terminate in e.g. Merced, my conclusion is that CHSRA simply solved the wrong problem.

Instead of a narrow focus on the fastest line haul time for SF-LA, it should have picked the solution that delivered the biggest bang for buck for all of Northern California. Of course, Parsons Brinkerhoff, the Mineta Institute and others are more interested in just maximizing the bucks – never mind the bang.

As a result, there will be no relief for highways 80, 580, 880 or 680 nor for ACE. There will be no connection to the HSR network in the East Bay nor in the Livermore Valley. Nor will there be a Central Valley connection north of Fresno for many, many years. The Delta counties will not attract as large a share of the state’s incremental population as they otherwise might have, with knock-on effects throughout Northern California. Unsurprisingly, prop 1 support will now be a lot weaker north and east of San Jose than it could have – and should have – been.

But oh well, it’s not like the French, Germans, Spaniards or Brits hadn’t made any seriously dumb decisions when they were building their own HSR systems. I expect much the same is true of Japan, professional transportation planners all seem to have some difficulty in thinking laterally.

It’s funny that HSR opponents (which you may not be) always bring up BART SFO as the “OMG this could be a total disaster” worst-case scenario for HSR. BART SFO went overbudget by 25% (from $1.167b to $1.488b). The most optimistic ridership projections I’ve ver seen for it were 68,000 by 2010, though Wikipedia cites 50,000 as the original forecast. BART SFO ridership is currently on track to reach 45,000 by 2010, or 66% of the most optimistic projections.

What does this mean for HSR? It means that the “worst case total disaster” scenario that opponents trot out is that it costs $50 billion to build (instead of $40 billion) and attracts 77 million riders by 2030 (the most optimistic projections I’ve seen are 117 million riders).

That would be more passengers than are currently handled by LAX + SFO + SAN + OAK + SJC + SMF all combined together – nearly our entire commercial air transport system combined. I would consider that a big success, and this is in the “nightmare” scenario!

So…?”

Seriously. What is the issue? The lack of knowledge regarding high speed operations is unfortunate, albeit understandable given that people out here have no exposure to high speed operations.

Forget going overseas. Operation near 160 mph through neighborhoods like Morgan Hill is standard not just in other countries, but in the US itself. Acela Express operates at 150 mph between Boston and Providence (a distance of 43 miles), including 150 mph operation with no problems at all through the city centers of Mansfield, Attleboro, and South Attleboro. These cities have populations of 20,000 to 40,000, very comparable to places like Morgan Hill (pop 33,000) or Gilroy (pop 45,000).

Yes, but how likely is that to happen?

“Note that speed profile for Pachecho assumes 160+mph operation through residential neighborhoods in South San Jose and Morgan Hill!!”

So…?

Travel times for Altamont:
LA-SF: 2:36

Travel times for Pachecho:
LA-SF: 2:38

Note that speed profile for Pachecho assumes 160+mph operation through residential neighborhoods in South San Jose and Morgan Hill!!